Who is Left Behind & What is the Mark of YHWH vs the Mark of the Beast

Who is Really “Left Behind” and who is “Taken”

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Image © 2014 119 Ministries. Used with permission. Visit http://www.119ministries.com

Once I actually started studying the Word of YHWH for myself, the layers of lies that I had been taught just started to peel away. When I was in the church, I always saw contradictions between what I read in the Word and what the pastors would teach. This never sat right with me, but I’d just sweep my questions and feelings under the rug because after all, these people went to Bible College and surely they knew more than me. NOT.

 

I believe that the pre-trib rapture is a very dangerous doctrine and is rooted in pride and arrogance of the church. It’s a feel good, tickle the ears doctrine that is not rooted in Scripture. Please tell the precious believers that are being persecuted every single day for their belief in Yeshua that they will escape the tribulation and be raptured away. They face tribulation every day. Their villages are burned and the women and children are raped and murdered. They are set on fire, beheaded, and tortured beyond belief. If that’s not tribulation, I don’t know what is. The reason this lie is so easily believed here in the United States is because we have never faced the kind of persecution that other countries have. What will those who believe in the pre-trib rapture do when that kind of persecution does come onto our soil? If you think it will never touch us, you are sadly mistaken. Who does the Western church think she is to think she is above persecution? Who does she think she is to believe that she is so special as to not have to go through tribulation? That’s pride and arrogance on her part. Tribulation is what refines us and tests our faith. Tribulation is for our good. Tribulation is for YHWH’s people.  When the pre-trib rapture fails to happen, millions will be shaking their fists at YHWH and lose their footing and faith.

 

Let’s let Scripture speak for itself and let’s see what it has to say about whom exactly is left behind and who is taken away. Let’s peel away the lies and false doctrines that we have been taught.

 

First off, what does Yeshua say in Matthew 24:29-31?

Immediately AFTER the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

When are the elect gathered? …After the days of tribulation, not before.

 

Let’s examine the Scriptures more closely to see who is left and who is taken. In Matthew 24:37-41, Yeshua says, “But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.”

So, who is left behind? …The righteous (Noah and his family). Who is taken? …The wicked.

 

Also, let’s examine the parable of the wheat and the tares in Matthew 13:24-30 to see if there is a second witness to this.

Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? From whence then hath it tares? He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?

But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

 

What harvest is being spoken of? …The end time harvest. Again, who is taken? …The tares (the unrighteous).

 

Let’s get another witness to the above. Matthew 13:36-43 says,

Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

So again, we see the tares (unrighteous) being taken and the wheat (righteous) being left to shine forth.

 

Let’s look at another witness to this. Luke 17:23-37 says,

And as it was in the days of Noah, so also it will be in the days of the Son of Man. They were eating, drinking, marrying, giving in marriage, until the day Noah went into the ark. And the flood came and destroyed all. And likewise, as it was in the days of Lot, they were eating, drinking, buying, selling, planting, building; but on the day Lot went out from Sodom, YHWH rained down fire and brimstone from the heaven and destroyed all of them.

According to those things, it will be in the day the Son of Man is revealed. In that day, he who will be on the housetop, let him not go down to take his goods from the house. And likewise, he in the field, let him not return to the things behind. Remember Lot’s wife. Whoever seeks to save his life, he will lose it. And whoever will lose it, he will preserve it. I say to you, In that night two will be on one bed; the one will be taken and the other will be left. Two will be grinding together; one will be taken and the other will be left. Two will be in the field, the one will be taken and the other will be left. And answering, they said to Him, To Where our Master? And He said to them, Where the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together.

 

Again, who is taken? …The wicked. Who is left? …The righteous.

 

Proverbs 10:30 says, “The way of the LORD is strength to the upright: but destruction shall be to the workers of iniquity. The righteous shall never be removed: but the wicked shall not inhabit the earth.

 

 

Matthew 24:15-22, Yeshua says:

And when you see the sign of uncleanness and desolation, that was spoken of by Daniel the prophet, which will stand in the holy place. He that reads let him understand. Then let those in Judea flee into the mountains; the one on the roof, let him not go down to take anything out of his house; and the one in the field, let him not turn back to take his garment. But woe to the ones having a child in womb, and to those nursing in those days! And pray that your flight will not occur in winter nor on the Sabbath. For there will be great suffering, such as has not happened from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever will be.

And except those days were shortened, not any flesh would live. But on account of the chosen, those days will be shortened.

 

Do you see that the elect ARE going through the tribulation?

After peeling back the false pre-tribulation doctrine, are you really certain you don’t want to be “LEFT BEHIND”????

 

To further establish my point, let’s consider where the word rapture comes from. Instead of thinking of the “rapture”, think of the “appearance, or the coming of Christ”. The idea around the rapture as North American Christians have understood it, was a theological development around the time of John Nelson Darby in the 1800’s, which have inspired Christian dispensationalist in the U.S., which gave rise to the “Left Behind” series of books by Tim Lahaye. The rapture theology is not necessarily a New Testament concept, and even if it was understood literally, it is only mentioned once, as opposed to other New Testament issues which are mentioned numerous times, such as the resurrection. The word “rapture” does not occur in the Bible. Rapture is the English translation of the Latin word rapiemur.
From the Latin Vulgate Bible, 1st Thessalonians:
4:17 deinde nos qui vivimus qui relinquimur simul rapiemur cum illis in nubibus obviam Domino in aera et sic semper cum Domino erimus

And rapiemur is the Latin translation of the Greek word “Harpazo”, which means to catch away by force.

Translated to English as:
1st Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we be always with the Lord

The word that evolved into ‘rapture’ was ‘rapiemur’. That’s the first person plural, passive, of the verb ‘rapio, rapere’, which is translated as ‘we….shall….be caught up…’

The parts of the verb are rapio, rapere, rapui, raptus. Its meanings are ‘drag off, snatch, destroy, seize, carry off’. The future participle (English does not have an equivalent) is ‘rapturus’, one form of which is ‘raptura’. The future participle translates roughly as ‘about to carry off’. From ‘raptura’ it’s a short jump to the English transliteration ‘rapture’.

1 Corinthians 15:52 is often quoted as being relevant to the rapture to
“in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed”

A more insightful look at the concept of being changed in the twinkling of any eye may be to look at the transfiguration of Jesus (Yeshua), in which two apostles were taken up to a mountain and got a glimpse at Jesus (Yeshua) in his full glory that was to come at the resurrection.

 

CONTEXT: Look at the surrounding Scripture to better understand the text. In many cases, the context is related to other verses in Torah (at times making direct and/or indirect references) Let’s look at the surrounding Scripture for the “Rapture” texts. As we’ve established based on the earlier verses listed via Matthew & Luke the context of the verses shows that the people “taken” are not taken to heaven, but are taken away to the brimstone. And the people “left” are those who are saved, left to enjoy eternity.

 

And what about the context of the 1 Thessalonians passage?
1 Thess 4
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.
5:1 But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you.
2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.
3 For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape.
4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief.
5 You are all sons of light and sons of the day. We are not of the night nor of darkness.

I have heard Rapture teachers cite 1 Thess. 4:18 in defense of their doctrine: “Therefore comfort one another with these words.” Rapture teachers claim that there would be no “comfort” in Paul’s teaching on the Rapture if Christians could not escape the Great Tribulation under the Antichrist.

Again, context! To what “comfort” is Paul referring? He states it clearly in verse 15. The Thessalonian Christians misunderstood the doctrine of the resurrection. They were afraid that their friends who died would miss the return of Christ. Paul assures them that “the dead in Christ will rise first,” and then believers who are still alive on earth will join them in meeting Christ. That’s where the “comfort” applies, not on the matter of the Tribulation.

So, in short, the answer to the question,

“Who are the ones taken?” Unbelievers.

“Who are the ones left?” Believers.

 

Once you really study YHWH’s Word, the Truth is easy to see. Stop buying into the false notion that your pastor knows more about the Word than you do. They go to Bible school to learn all these false doctrines and many of them know they’re wrong but the Truth doesn’t tickle as many ears or bring in as much money, so they abandon truth for lies. Study The Word for yourself to show yourself approved. Take YHWH at His Word, not your pastor’s commentary on His Word.

 

The “Mark of YHWH” vs the “Mark of the Beast”

We are told the mark of the beast will be in the hand and/or the forehead. With today’s present technology we know that a microscopic computer chip can be placed under the skin. But is scripture talking about a tattoo or a microchip? Or is this a spiritual reference? The hand represents labor, physical activities, and actions. The forehead represents knowledge, understanding, to serve, an oath, and what we believe. To understand this we must turn to the Tanach (Old Testament) to discover what the “Mark of YHWH” is.

 

Exodus13:6-10

Seven days you shall eat unleavened bread, and on the seventh day keep a feast to YHWH.

Unleavened bread shall be eaten the seven days. And leavened bread for you shall not be seen; yea, no leaven shall be seen among you in all your boundaries. And you shall tell your son in that day, saying, It is because of what YHWH did for me when I came out from Egypt.

And it shall be for a sign to you on your hand, and a memorial between your eyes, so that the Torah of YHWH may be in your mouth. For with a strong hand YHWH brought you out from Egypt. And you shall keep this ordinance at its appointed time, from year to year.

 

 

Exodus31:12-17

And YHWH spoke to Moses, saying, And you speak to the sons of Israel, charging them, only My Sabbaths you shall keep; for it is a sign between Me and you for your generation; to know that I am YHWH your sanctifier. And you shall keep the Sabbath, for it is holy for you; the profaners of it shall surely be executed; for everyone doing work in it, that soul shall be cut off from the midst of his people. Work may be done six days, and on the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to YHWH; everyone doing work on the Sabbath day surely shall be put to death. And the sons of Israel shall guard the Sabbath, to observe and do the Sabbath for their generations; it is a never ending covenant. It is a sign forever between Me and the sons of Israel; for in six days YHWH made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day He rested and was refreshed.

 

 

Deuteronomy6:4-9

Hear, O Israel, YHWH our Elohim is YHWH echad. And you shall love YHWH your Elohim with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. And these Words which I am commanding you today shall be on your heart. And you shall diligently teach them to your sons, and shall speak of them as you sit in your house, and as you walk in the way, and as you are lying down, and as you are rising up. And you shall bind them for a sign on your hand; and they shall be for frontlets between your eyes. And you shall write them on the doorposts of your house, and on your gates.

 

Deuteronomy11:16-21

Take heed to yourselves, that your heart not be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other Elohim, and bow down to them; and the anger of YHWH glow against you, and He shut up the heavens, and there be no rain, and the ground not give her increase, and you perish quickly from off the good land which YHWH is giving to you. And you shall lay these Words up in your hearts, and in your souls, and shall bind them for a sign on your hand. And they shall be for frontlets between your eyes. And you shall teach them to your sons by speaking of them as you sit in your house, and as you walk in the way, and as you lie down, and as you rise up. And you shall write them on the side posts of your house, and on your gates, that your days and the days of your sons may be multiplied in the land which YHWH has sworn to your fathers, to give to them, as the days of the heavens over the earth.

 

Ezekiel20:12

And I also gave them My Sabbaths to be a sign between Me and them, that they might know that I am YHWH who sets them apart.

 

 

Ezekiel20:19-20

I am YHWH your Elohim, walk in My statutes, and keep My judgments, and do them. And guard My Sabbaths to keep them holy, and they shall be a sign between Me and you, that you may know that I am YHWH your Elohim.

 

So, we see that there is a clear distinguishing mark of YHWH that is in the hand and in the forehead of those who keep His Commanded Feasts.  It is not a tattoo or a microchip but is instead the act of obedience to His Commanded Feasts, which includes the weekly Sabbath. By keeping His Feasts we have in our hand and in our forehead the “Mark of YHWH”.

 

In contrast let’s compare Daniel 7:25 – “He will speak words against the Most High and will harass the set apart ones of the Most High. He will think of changing times (Feast Days) and Laws (Torah) and they will be delivered into his power for a time, times, and half a time.”

 

So the enemy will change Passover to Easter (Ostara). He will change the birth of Yeshua from the first day of Sukkot to Dec. 25th. He will change YHWH’s seventh day Sabbath to the first day of the week and teach that “Jesus nailed the Torah (Law) to the cross”.

 

Then we find this reference to a mark in the hand and upon the forehead in Revelation 13:15-16 – “And it was given him to put life into the image of the beast; and to cause that all they who would not worship the image of the beast, should be slain: and to cause that all, great and small, rich and poor, bond and free, should receive a mark on their right hands, or upon their foreheads;”

 

Does this mean the beast will not use a tattoo or a microchip? Not at all! He can use all means to counterfeit the “Mark of YHWH”, especially with those who are not aware of or do not understand the “Mark of YHWH”. If it is not obvious enough let’s clarify that the mark of the beast is the anti-thesis of the “Mark of YHWH”.

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YHWH declared the seventh day as a holy, set apart day. The Sabbath is a day of rest; a memorial of the creation (yes, we celebrate the creation every Shabbat). But the world religious system (anti-Messiah) changed YHWH’s appointed Sabbath to the first day of the week to honor pagan sun worship.  Christianity has chosen to have “church” on Sun-day which, upon examination, is not a Sabbath at all. Just look at all the Christians running to the restaurants, Wal-Mart, Home Depot, cutting the grass or painting the house after “Church” on Sun-day. The truth is that Christianity has no true Sabbath.

 

Rather than observing and keeping holy YHWH’s Passover, Christianity has chosen to honor the pagan holy day of Ostara (Easter). They have even incorporated the very same pagan egg laying rabbits as the fertility symbolism of this pagan holy day.

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Christianity changed the date of Messiah’s birth from the first of Sukkot (Feast of Tabernacles) to the birthday of Tammuz, Sol Invictus and a host of other pagan deities. But, this is not a Moed (set apart Feast) of YHWH. Nowhere in scripture are we instructed to observe the birth of anyone. How are we instructed to remember Messiah? …Through His death and resurrection, during the Feast of Passover.

 

The vast majority of Christian denominations do not observe, preach, nor understand the seven Holy, set apart Feasts of YHWH, all of which point to Messiah. This religious world system has totally created their own holy days while pushing aside YHWH’s set apart times. It is man trying to dictate to Elohim how and when man will worship the creator as opposed to man observing and honoring how YHWH has instructed us to approach Him. This has clearly become the religious system of anti-Messiah with a distinct mark in the hand and in the forehead. So please, explain, what is there about Christianity that comes even remotely close to having the “Mark of YHWH”?

 

This is a call for Christianity to return to the faith once delivered to the Set Apart believers (Jude1:3) and to reject the mark of the beast – the worldly man-made religious system that defies the living Elohim.

 

Shalom,

April Morasco via FGT

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29 thoughts on “Who is Left Behind & What is the Mark of YHWH vs the Mark of the Beast

  1. what about luke 21:36 “Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.” God himself says that we will escape it. And with the feasts, Jesus fulfilled that on the cross, we do not need to go through empty religious ritual to be sayed

    • The word used for escape is ekphugein in the Greek. It is the same word used in Acts 19:16 for flee. The context isn’t saying watch ye therefore with the idea of escape rendering a pretrib rapture. But it’s saying watch so that way you can flee like what’s mentioned in Zechariah’s prophecy about running to the mountains. Or another way we can look at it is to escape through ie come out alive, never tasting death. Also with the Feasts, you say Jesus fulfilled it. But consider Matthew 5 where Jesus says he did not come to ABOLISH the Torah and Prophets but to fulfill (meaning to make full). It’s not empty rituals. Torah means instructions. Paul says shall we then nullify the Torah by this faith? Let it not be so, rather we UPHOLD the Torah! Romans 3:31. Fulfill is to bring into fullness. Christ brought the Torah into it’s fullness meaning he explained it or filled it up, ie he walked it out perfectly. Yet we are to walk AS Christ walked. We hold to the view that we are grafted into the Olive branch as mentioned in Scripture. As being grafted in, we are now a part of the commonwealth of Israel Scripturally. If you have any specific questions, do ask. We don’t bite. But please consider our words with an open heart as we too once believed like you!

  2. [Great blog, FGT. Spotted the following on the web & just want to share it. His blessings on you and yours!]

    Pretrib Rapture Pride

    Pretrib rapture promoters like Thomas Ice give the impression they know more than the early Church Fathers, the Reformers, the greatest Greek New Testament scholars including those who produced the KJV Bible, the founders of their favorite Bible schools, and even their own mentors!
    Ice’s mentor, Dallas Sem. president John Walvoord, couldn’t find anyone holding to pretrib before 1830 – and Walvoord called John Darby and his Brethren followers “the early pretribulationists” (RQ, pp. 160-62). Ice belittles Walvoord and claims that several pre-1830 persons, including “Pseudo-Ephraem” and a “Rev. Morgan Edwards,” taught a pretrib rapture. Even though the first one viewed Antichrist’s arrival as the only “imminent” event, Ice (and Grant Jeffrey) audaciously claim he expected an “imminent” pretrib rapture! And Ice (and John Bray) have covered up Edwards’ historicism which made a pretrib rapture impossible! Google “Morgan Edwards’ Rapture View” and journalist/historian Dave MacPherson’s “Deceiving and Being Deceived” for documentation on these and similar historical distortions.
    The same pretrib defenders, when combing ancient books, deviously read “pretrib” into phrases like “before Armageddon,” “before the final conflagration,” and “escape all these things”!
    BTW, the KJV translators’ other writings found in London’s famed British Library (where MacPherson has researched) don’t have even a hint of pretrib rapturism. Is it possible that Ice etc. have found pretrib “proof” in the KJV that its translators never found?
    Pretrib merchandisers like Ice claim that nothing is better pretrib proof than Rev. 3:10. They also cover up “Famous Rapture Watchers” (on Google) which shows how the greatest Greek NT scholars of all time interpreted it.
    Pretrib didn’t flourish in America much before the 1909 Scofield Bible which has pretribby “explanatory notes” in its margins. Not seen in the margins was jailed forger Scofield’s criminal record throughout his life that David Lutzweiler has documented in his recent book “The Praise of Folly” which is available online.
    Biola University’s doctrinal statement says Christ’s return is “premillennial” and “before the Tribulation.” Although universities stand for “academic freedom,” Biola has added these narrow, restrictive phrases – non-essentials the founders purposely didn’t include in their original doctrinal statement when Biola was just a small Bible institute! And other Christian schools have also belittled their founders.
    Ice, BTW, has a “Ph.D” issued by a tiny Texas school that wasn’t authorized to issue degrees! Ice now says that he’s working on another “Ph.D” via the University of Wales in Britain. For light on the degrees of Ice’s scholarliness, Google “Bogus degree scandal prompts calls to wind up University of Wales,” “Thomas Ice (Bloopers),” “be careful in polemics – Peripatetic Learning,” and “Walvoord Melts Ice.” Also Google “Thomas Ice (Hired Gun)” – featured by media luminary Joe Ortiz on his Jan. 30, 2013 “End Times Passover” blog.
    Other fascinating Google articles include “The Unoriginal John Darby,” “X-raying Margaret,” “Margaret Macdonald’s Rapture Chart,” “Pretrib Rapture’s Missing Lines,” “Edward Irving is Unnerving,” “Pretrib Rapture Politics,” “Pretrib Rapture Secrets,” “Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty,” “Pretrib Hypocrisy,” “Pretrib Rapture Secrecy,” and “Roots of Warlike Christian Zionism” – most from the author of “The Rapture Plot” (the most accurate documentation on pretrib rapture history) which can be obtained by calling 800.643.4645.
    Can anyone guess who the last proud pretrib rapture holdout will be?
    (Postscript: For another jolt or two Google “The Background Obama Can’t Cover Up.”)

    • Lou, I dunno if your even reading this, but all you’re doing is attacking the pretrib rapture doctrine founders, WITHOUT ANY BIBLE TO BACK IT UP.

      PS I dunno about holdouts but I’ve been to a few churches over the years and studied a lot about the rapture, spent an entire year of school on it, and this site is the first time i’ve even heard of a post-trib rapture doctrine.
      PPS this pretrib rapture doctrine did not just pop up like an ugly ducking in the 1800s, there are many early church fathers who taught it and many doctrines written for it, including: Papias (60-130), Clement of Rome (90-100), The Sherpherd of Hermas (96-150), Ignatius of Antioch (98-117), Barnabas (100), The Didache (100-160),Justin Martyr (110-165),The Epistle of Barnabas (117-138), Irenaeus (120-202), Tertullian (145-220), Hippolytus (185-236), Cyprian (200-250), Lactantius (260-330).
      PPPS just because these guys have done wrong does not make all their teaching irrelevant. Two of Jesus’ 12 WERE bad guys, Simon was a zealot and a Canaanite, and Matthew was a tax collector. In fact, I’ve done some bad jujumagumbo in my life, but God makes us whole and saves us and makes us new and saves us as demonstrated in (1 John 1:9)(Romans 10:9-10)(Romans 8:38-39)(Hebrews 7:25)(Romans 6;23)(Isaiah 43:25-26)(Acts 3:19)(Isaiah 1:18) and one of my personal favorite Luke 1:49 For He who is MIGHTY has done great things for me and holy is his name.

  3. okay, just so i know where ur going with this. If I use today’s buying system and I don’t partake in the different feasts (like me), yet I believe that Jesus is my savior who forgives me of my sin (like me) and then I die (because I will). Am I going to heaven or hell?

    PS: I’m holding you to that promise that you don’t bite 🙂

  4. The issue you have is that you think that if one actually keeps the feasts because they are commanded and called perfect in Psalm 119 by an unchanging God, then you believe that it is working one’s way to salvation ie legalistic. We are here to say that we don’t keep these things TO be saved, but rather BECAUSE we are saved. We keep it out of LOVE inspired OBEDIENCE. Even IF fulfill means to complete, it doesn’t mean abolish, heaven and earth haven’t even passed away as stated in Matthew 5. The shadows point forward and backwards. This is why the Feasts are still in place in the Millennial Kingdom as stated in Revelation.

  5. “Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach.” Deuteronomy 30:11
    “I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.” Philippians 4:13
    “1 Blessed are those whose ways are blameless,
    who walk according to the Torah of YHWH.
    2 Blessed are those who keep his statutes
    and seek him with all their heart—
    3 they do no wrong
    but follow his ways.
    4 You have laid down precepts
    that are to be fully obeyed.
    5 Oh, that my ways were steadfast
    in obeying your decrees!
    6 Then I would not be put to shame
    when I consider all your commands.
    7 I will praise you with an upright heart
    as I learn your righteous laws.
    8 I will obey your decrees;
    do not utterly forsake me.” Psalm 119:1-8

    We we must realize is that the commands of the Torah are not a burden. It is not the law of sin and death.

    “So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of Torahlessness and fall from your secure position. But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen.” 2 Peter 3:14-18

    Peter even says Paul’s letters are hard to understand and that the unlearned and unstable twist by the errors of Torahlessness. We must recognize that Paul is a Jew writing with a Jewish mindset, Jesus too grew up Jewish. We have to understand the culture and history to understand exactly what they are saying in it’s proper context. We believe they NEVER taught against Torah. And we can back this up all throughout Scripture. By the way, if Torah is what’s done away with, then why do the Jews have to keep it? If it was so broken down, why did anyone EVER have to keep it? What our Heavenly Father creates is perfect as David calls it. It is unchanging. It is pure. We keep these words because we love our heavenly Father. If and ONLY if it is not done out of love, it is then not good. Our translators have translated many things with a bias, using Synagogue with Synagogue of Satan, yet church where they see fit, Old Testament and New Testament when that’s not what the text says, as well as many other things…

    “Then Paul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees, called out in the Sanhedrin, “My brothers, I AM (Present tense) a Pharisee, descended from Pharisees. I stand on trial because of the hope of the resurrection of the dead.” Acts 23:6

    If you’d like added clarity, check out our various teachings and such. But to answer your question, NO. You do not go to hell. The fact of the matter is, we are held accountable for obeying Christ to what we know to do right. If we KNOW something is wrong and yet we still do it, we will be held accountable. Faith is best rendered as faithfulness (an action word). Faith without works is dead. BUT, WHEN you learn that there is more you are to do, maybe from misunderstandings, lack of knowledge, maybe even poor doctrine, you make changes progressively and you KEEP/HOLD TO what you NOW know to be right. With more understanding comes more responsibility. You can’t hold a Kindergartener to Calculus principles. But when you learn that Torah is not bondage, that it’s not bad, that keeping the Feasts works like a shadow pointing FORWARD to the second coming, you began to follow it out of love. And you begin to see how much of a blessing it is and you’re understanding of Scripture begins to increase because you truly begin to learn the culture and understand all that the context is saying.

  6. Quick couple of points-

    1 I do NOT think that in order to go to heaven you HAVE to do works. Ephesians 2:8-9
    2 I agree with what you say about we follow the law/serve god/love other because it is “LOVE inspired OBEDIENCE”
    3 I agree that the law (torah) is something that we should obey through LOVE inspired OBEDIENCE (i like that term i’m going to start using it in conversations)
    4 Colossians 2:16-17 “Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.” So basically, it’s cool if you do the feasts and stuff, just don’t let it be just ritual
    5 I do not participate in the feasts, but it ain’t bad if you do and it ain’t bad if u don’t as long as Jesus is the meaning (same applies to the sabbath and Easter etc.etc.)

    With those few key points out of the way I wanna get back to my questions on your pro- trib (is that watchu call it nvm) rapture thing.

    1 The rapture is not a key point for salvation (just saying that so we both know where the others coming from, don’t bite me)
    2 I believe that the bible should be taken literally. We as Christians must be careful not to over-interpret scripture to match OUR beliefs (if I want to I can relate the consumption of sour cream to the rate of biking accidents in the US, just saying) God tells what we need to know plainly, not in riddles.
    3 If the barcode is the mark of the beast it should be the opposite God, or the anti-God, while u say that the mark of God (or Yahweh) is to return to the torah. They don’t seem like opposites to me. Also how did this scripture apply before barcodes, did they just not use it or something.
    4 If the barcode and the use of it is the mark of the beast, then you, me, and 99.99999999% of the people who have lived in the past 50 years will be annihilated (Rev 14:10) don’t think that’s in God’s plan
    5 Chronologically, we are raptured (bear with me), the 7-year tribulation occurs, God comes back for those saved during the tribulation and 144,000 Jewish witnesses, Millenial Reign, new heaven and new earth created.

    Finally, I believe that we are raptured (rapturo in the latin, harpazo in Greek, meaning caught up) before the tribulation. In support I bring back Matthew 5:17 (i don’t care if it means flee or escape, they both mean to get away from something i.e. the tribulation) and use Matthew 24:44 (if the tribulation occurred and we waited 7 years we would know and expect when Jesus would come). In addition, Revelation 3:10 says that because we have kept God’s word we will not experience the tribulation (also 1 Thes 1:10), only the disobedient go through it (Ephesians 5:6)

  7. Tomothy, when looking at the Bible from a modern Christian theological perspective, you are going to misunderstand many references. For example, 2 Peter 3:16 is a warning against the ignorant and unstable twisting Paul’s words as they do the other Scriptures to their own destruction. What you have written is pure textbook commentary by modern Christian theologians who think Paul was saying the Law was abolished. Ephesians 2:15 refers to the law of commandments found in ordinances, which is referring to Pharisaical or Rabbinical Judaism and not the Torah. Colossians 2:14 is referring to the charges against us as well as our sins being nailed to the cross, not the Torah itself. Romans 10:4 is saying that Christ is the end result or end purpose of the Law, not the abolishment of it, according to the Greek word telos G5056.

    Something you are overlooking is the fact that the original apostles, the ones who actually walked with the Messiah, didn’t escape tribulation of their time, and they were without a doubt much stronger in faith than most throughout history and alive today. Escaping the tribulation is confirmed in places such as Revelation 12:17, where one has the testimony of the Messiah and is keeping the commandments. One thing you forgot to include in your referencing Ephesians 2:8-9 is verse 10, which says that we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them. Here is the problem with your presentation of this reference by purposely omitting Ephesians 2:10 while speaking against works. Matthew 25:31-46 is the parable of the sheep and goats. What happened to the ones who didn’t feed the hungry, clothe the naked, shelter the homeless, or visit and minister to those sick and/or imprisoned? They were identified as goats, called wicked and were cast into outer darkness. Luke 13:6-9 is the parable of the fruitless fig tree. Since the fig tree bore no fruit for 3 years, the master wanted to uproot in and cast it into the fire because it was making the area it occupied a waste. The gardener responded by saying to let him throw some manure on it and give it 1 more year, and if it still produced no fruit, then uproot it. Finally, how can you claim to walk as Messiah walked according to 1 John 2:6 when He was obedient and did the works of the Torah and you are speaking against the Torah? Did you overlook Matthew 5:17-18 that says do not think that He came to destroy the Torah or the Prophets, for He came not to destroy, but to fulfill, and that until heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall by no means pass from the Torah, until all is done? When will Matthew 5:18 be fulfilled? Revelation 21:1, where John saw a new heaven and a new earth and this follows the final judgment.

    While it is true that salvation is not based on your own righteousness, which is what you feel to be righteous according to your definition, and that you cannot earn salvation by your own abilities, it is also true that you can forfeit your salvation for being a wicked and slothful servant. If you read Matthew 7:21-23, this area is a warning against those who are living in lawlessness, which is defined in 1 John 3:4 as transgression against the Torah, and the consequence will be rejection during judgment in spite of calling the Messiah as Master and in His name casting out demons, prophesying and doing many wonderful works. Regardless of how much time you have been a Christian, if you become comfortable in mainstream Christianity’s theology and you do not test and examine the traditions, doctrines, holidays, etc. in the light of the Bible, you are going to find out the hard way what happens to those who turn their ear from hearing the Torah (Proverbs 28:9) and despises the Torah (Proverbs 13:13).

  8. David and everybody else,
    1 I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT JESUS ABOLISHED THE LAW!
    2 I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT JESUS ABOLISHED THE LAW!
    3 the same as number 1
    4 I agree with what you say that the originals disciples faced tribulation
    5 I agree that all of us face tribulation/persecution
    6 However, we, as Christians, will be brought up to heaven (raptured) and escape THE tribulation (i.e. the four horses of the apocalypse, 7 trumpets,7 seals, etc. etc.)
    7 I did not PURPOSELY omit Ephesians 2:10
    8 Yes we are to do good works (Ephesians 2:10), it should be automatic through LOVE inspired OBEDIENCE (i used it again, man i love that term), but they do not bring us to salvation (Ephesians 2:8-9)

    To face your other point I will tell a story, “Steve tells everybody that he is saved, he goes to church, he attends the weekly bible study, and doesn’t seem to curse. Sounds like a good guy. WRONG, when he goes home he yells at his wife, sits at the TV watching football and generally being is a slob (so not a Christian). However, Bob goes to church, attends the weekly bible study, and doesn’t curse either. Also he is loving, he keeps God’s word in his heart, he genuinely wants to share the gospel with people, he praises the Lord with all of his heart. He even gives 15% of his income instead of 10 because he loves God. He obeys the torah.” END STORY Sure it’s not a requirement, if we fail we are forgiven (1 John 1:9), yet we obey the law (Torah, whatever) because it is a natural fruit of Christianity. If I am a fig tree (Christian) (like Bob) I’m going to bear figs/fruits of the Christian life (obedience to the law/Torah, loving the Lord, fruits of the Spirit (Galations 5:22) etc etc.) If I say I’m a fig tree (Christian), yet I’m not (like Steve) then I’m not going to bear figs/fruits of the Christian life.
    Next Point-

    9 check point #1
    10 I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT JESUS ABOLISHED THE TORAH!
    11 If I’m a “wicked and slothful servant” than I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN AND THEREFORE AM GOING TO DIE!
    12 Colossians 2:16-17 “Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.” So basically, it’s cool if I do not do the feasts and stuff, and celebrate Christs resurrection on Easter, or have Sabbath on Sunday, or celebrate Christ’s birth on Christmas, or sing jingle-bells. As long as Jesus Christ is the center then we are fine. (if you disagree show me a Bible verse)
    13 I DO NOT DESPISE THE TORAH!

    PS the name is Tomathy, with an “A”
    PPS [FGT] and everybody else address my previous points on the rapture timing ’cause that’s what this whole debate is about
    PPPS I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT JESUS ABOLISHED THE TORAH
    PPPPS in case you didn’t notice TORAH=GOOD 🙂

    • Tomathy, when you say “it is cool if do not do the feasts and stuff…”, what you are really saying is that you can live however you choose to live and not according to the Creator’s instructions. At this point, who are you really listening to? Since you like analogies, what does an employer call an employee that does not follow company guidelines and rules? Insubordinate and potentially unemployed. When you take a verse like Colossians 2:16 and apply that mindset you expressed, you are twisting the context of what Paul was talking about. When Paul said do not let any man judge you in these things, he was referring to do not let any man judge you for keeping them. In Leviticus 23:14,21,31,41, there is an instruction that you are to observe these forever in your generations in all your dwellings. By you rejecting these, and learning the ways of the heathen by observing Saturnalia aka Christmas, Ishtar aka Easter, Lupercalia aka St. Valentine’s Day, and Venerable Day of the Sun aka Sunday, your true god is the source of these. There is an old saying, which is you worship whom you obey. Who established the holidays of Christmas, Easter, St. Valentine’s Day, Sunday rest, etc.? The Roman Catholic Papacy.

      Do you really want to continue justifying your beliefs or are you ready to repent and come out of her?

  9. This is Eric Turner from FGT.Concerning the pre-trib Rapture. It is pretty clear that the snatching away that Paul speaks of will NOT occur until the dead in Messiah are resurrected.

    1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord SHALL NOT PREVENT THEM THAT ARE ASLEEP. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with THE TRUMP OF GOD: and THE DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE FIRST: 17 >>>Then<<>>GENTILES<<<, who do not possess the law, DO INSTINCTIVELY WHAT THE LAW REQUIRES, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They SHOW WHAT THE LAW REQUIRES IS WRITTEN ON THEIR HEARTS, a fact to which their own consciences testify, and their thoughts will either accuse or excuse them 16 on that day when God, through Jesus Christ, will judge people's secrets according to my gospel.

    So the proof that one is saved is that they do the requirements of the law. The Apostle John agrees. The evidence that one has come to know Yeshua is if they keep the commandments.

    1Jn 5:2 BY THIS we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome.

    We will be judged and rewarded according to our works, AFTER we receive redemption, as Prophesied. In the beginning of my statement, I spoke about Matthew 5. Most Christians will say that the Messiah fulfilled the law therefor we no longer need to do them. That would be a fine argument if Yeshua/Jesus fulfilling the law was the only mentioned precept of exactly when the Torah/Law would pass away, but the issue is that the Prophets also must be fulfilled.

    Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, OR THE PROPHETS: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

    This says if your righteousness does not accede that of the scribes and Pharisees you will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. It also says that the Prophets must all be fulfilled and Heaven and Earth must pass away before one jot or tittle can be removed from the Law. If you do not believe Yeshua abolished the law as you claim, why do you not keep the law? I cited James 2 to show you that Faith without works is dead. Most would say these are not the works of Moses, but the "works of Christ". So, let us test that.

    Those good works are clothing the needy, feeding the poor, and healing the sick, binding up the broken, and taking care of widows and orphans, all Commandments in Moses. James also says do not be impartial in judgment, this also, commandments directly from Moses.

    Exo 22:25 “If you lend money to any of my people with you who is poor, you shall not be like a moneylender to him, and you shall not exact interest from him. :26 If ever you take your neighbor’s cloak in pledge, you shall return it to him before the sun goes down, 27 for that is his only covering, and it is his cloak for his body; in what else shall he sleep? And if he cries to me, I will hear, for I am compassionate.

    Exo 23:10 “For six years you shall sow your land and gather in its yield, 11 but the seventh year you shall let it rest and lie fallow, that the poor of your people may eat; and what they leave the beasts of the field may eat. You shall do likewise with your vineyard, and with your olive orchard.

    Lev 19:10 And you shall not strip your vineyard bare, neither shall you gather the fallen grapes of your vineyard. You shall leave them for the poor and for the sojourner: I am the LORD your God.

    Exo 23:2 You shall not fall in with the many to do evil, nor shall you bear witness in a lawsuit, siding with the many, so as to pervert justice, 3 nor shall you be partial to a poor man in his lawsuit.

    Exo 30:15 The rich shall not give more, and the poor shall not give less, than the half shekel, when you give the LORD’s offering to make atonement for your lives.

    Exo 22:22 You shall not mistreat any widow or fatherless child. 23 If you do mistreat them, and they cry out to me, I will surely hear their cry, 24 and my wrath will burn, and I will kill you with the sword, and your wives shall become widows and your children fatherless.

    Deu 10:17 For the LORD your God is God of gods and Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God, who is not partial and takes no bribe. 18 He executes justice for the fatherless and the widow, and loves the sojourner, giving him food and clothing. 19 Love the sojourner, therefore, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.

    Well,it looks like James is talking about the works given BY GOD to Moses. NOWHERE in the Prophets is it written that believers, Jew or Gentile, would be exempt from observing the Sabbaths, Feasts, and New Moons. It states the contrary actually. I will ask you, WHAT WOULD JESUS DO? Would he break his father's law, or would he be a light for the Nations?

    Mat 5:14 “You are the LIGHT of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives light to all in the house. 16 In the same way, let your LIGHT shine before others, so that they may see your GOOD WORKS and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.

    A Parable must be interpreted, and there must be a key to explain it. We have an entire Book in the Bible designed to INTERPRET parables.

    Pro 1:1 The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel; 2 To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding; 3 To receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity; 4 To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion. 5 A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels: 6 To understand a proverb, and the INTERPRETATION; the words of the wise, and their DARK SAYINGS(Parables).

    The “light” Yeshua wants us to let shine before men in this parable is the law.

    Pro 6:23 For the commandment is a lamp; and the LAW IS LIGHT; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

    So, when Yeshua said let your light shine before men so they may see your GOOD WORKS and Glorify the Father in Heaven he was repeating the verses in Deuteronomy.

    Deut 4:5 Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. 6 Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. 7 For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? 8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

    Mat 13:10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. 13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. 14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: 15 For this people’s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should BE CONVERTED, and I should heal them.

    This says that they need be CONVERTED in order to be healed. Where was he getting this from? We know he did not speak His own words.

    Joh 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself. 18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him. 19 Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

    So, what is it these people who were hard of hearing and dull in their understanding need to be converted?

    Psa 19:7 The LAW of the LORD is PERFECT, CONVERTING THE SOUL: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple. 8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes. 9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether. 10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.

    So, in closing, no pre-trib rapture. No dismissal of even the least of the commandments given by God and recorded by Moses. I pray that you will come into the knowledge of the TRUTH.

    Psa 119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy LAW IS THE TRUTH.

    Please, let us reason, and please, heed the warnings of the Prophets.

    Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

    There is only one who is Prophesied to change the Law and it is not the Messiah.

    Dan 7:25 He shall speak words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and shall think to CHANGE THE TIMES AND THE LAW; and they shall be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time.

    So, will you follow the obedience of the true image of YHVH, the Torah/Law abiding and teaching Messiah, or the lawless one who will change the law? Choose whom you shall serve this day.

    Jos 24:15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

    Sincerely,
    Eric

  10. David, 1st off I think that the law/torah=good and that the obedience is a sign of being saved, we want to and can’t help but do so. For example, I was helping out at a local food drive and the guy in charge was just bursting with joy. He would give everyone hugs whether you liked it or not, he laughed at all of the jokes, and gave all the glory to Jesus. The guy could not have frowned if you commanded him to. It was NATURAL to him because HE LOVES JESUS.

    However, I do not believe that the feasts of israel are a requirement and now part of law. To add to your analogy if the employee disobeyed the company’s rules than I totally agree with what you say of him. However let’s say that the rules were put in place during a time when they were necesary, and that at some point in time they would no longer be required. The employee keeps the rule and obeys, then one day the boss comes in and says that that rule does not apply and that the term of the contract is up. If the employee continues to do it though it’s not necesary he only hurts himself.

    1 forever in the old testament did not mean forever as in endless it meant as in many generations
    a. for example if we say God lives forever than we do indeed mean endless, bu
    Daniel in Daniel 6:6 says: “King Darius, live forever” he simply means live a long life
    In 2 Samuel 7:16 God says that David’s kingdom will be forever, meaning very long because it was ended by Zedekiah in 586 BC, David even understands it to mean very long as he says in verse 19.
    2 The Bible itself says that the feasts will be cut off
    a. Daniel 9:25-27 speaking of Jesus’ coming and the aftermath. “25 Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble. 26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ HE WILL PUT AN END TO SACRIFICE AND OFFERING. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.”
    b. Matthew 27:50-51 hints at the cutting off of the feasts (And when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split.) We know from other passages that Jesus said ‘It is finished” (John 19:30) possibly referring to the law, this would certainly coincide with the split of the veil.
    c. Hebrews 9:8-9 says “In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.”
    d. Jesus was what the feasts pointed to, to celebrate the feasts now would be to look at a biography of what a person did many years ago, while you could still talk to that person and anticipate what he will do. Colossians 2:17 (16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.)
    e. Read acts 15. It tells of the story of men who went about commanding new converts to be circumsized (a part of the law by the way). The apostles basically say that the new converts should keep the main tenants of Christianity and a few other things(1 of which Paul actually disagreed with). The apostles said in verse 28 that “. . . it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things.”

    • Tomathy, there are a number of errors in your reply, and it all originates from the theology you are basing your faith upon. Forever has never meant a temporary time. By saying what you said, you are calling the Creator a liar by contradicting what He said. Forever in your generations in all your dwellings does not mean that when a family dies the appointed times no longer are valid. You are also accusing the Messiah of being a liar based on what He said in Matthew 5:18. Unless you are going to somehow claim and then prove that heaven and earth have passed away prior to Revelation 21:1, until means every jot and tittle of the Torah stands. Now, keep in mind that while the priesthood was transferred to Messiah, Messiah is the High Priest, Mediator, King and sacrifice.

      As for your reference to Daniel 9:25-27, you twisted the reference. It says the sacrifice and oblation, not the appointed times, will cease. The temple that was destroyed in 70 A.D. is the fulfillment of this since there hasn’t been a morning and evening sacrifice since that time. I recommend that before quoting verses, make sure you are very careful about the wording you use as well as the point you are making, because what you just did with this is add to and diminish the Creator’s words, which is forbidden according to Deuteronomy 4:2 and 12:32.

      Your point about “it is finished” does not refer to any of the instructions, but rather the work of redemption. You were probably not aware that this is a declaration made by the High Priest during the evening sacrifice at the 9th hour, so I will count this as you being unaware. I know you were taught to interpret “it is finished” the way you have, but you have been misinformed.

      Regarding the new covenant, which Hebrews 8:8-12 quotes from Jeremiah 31:31-34, the Torah is intact and placed in the inward parts and written on the hearts of the Creator’s people Israel. Considering what Yeshua said in Matthew 5:17-18, every instruction is transferred over to the new covenant with the only differences in that Yeshua is the High Priest, Mediator, King and sacrifice.

      Regarding Acts 15, you are forgetting about verse 21, which illustrates that the new believers would learn the rest of the instructions. What you are implying by your claim in verses 20 and 28 is that every other instruction is now irrelevant. As a result, you are saying that you can engage in worshipping other gods, bringing the name and character of the Creator to nothing, disregard the Sabbath, dishonor your father and mother, murder, commit adultery, steal, bear false witness, covet, and every other instruction except for abstaining from fornication, idolatry, things that are strangled and blood. It is far more consistent to interpret the four things as being a basic beginning of weightier matters than to say these are the only things expected. By saying what you said, you are also saying that the new converts do not even have to assemble with other believers.

      Tomathy, this is nothing more than a proverbial tennis match where rebuttals are exchanged. How about you take this challenge? Put aside whatever theology you base your faith upon and read the Bible from Genesis through Revelation. I make custom reading schedules and am willing to make one for you of any time length. The rule is you must start from Genesis and do not read from Matthew 1:1 until you have completely read through until the end of Malachi. With this in mind and excluding the theology, then read the New Testament. Once you see what was written prior to the Gospels and letters, you will see why the theology of Christianity is actually leading people into lawlessness.

  11. PS David I will get to the sabbath and “pagan holidays” tomorrow
    PPS Eric Turner I will also get to your comment tomorrow as well

    God bless,
    Tomathy Barnes

  12. This is Eric again, sorry I do not have my own personal address. I would like to answer each of your points by the numbers. I can see you do not have much understanding in the Hebrew language and that is indeed an issue. So, starting at 1.

    “1 forever in the old testament did not mean forever as in endless it meant as in many generations.
    a. for example if we say God lives forever than we do indeed mean endless, but Daniel in Daniel 6:6 says: “King Darius, live forever” he simply means live a long life In 2 Samuel 7:16 God says that David’s kingdom will be forever, meaning very long because it was ended by Zedekiah in 586 BC, David even understands it to mean very long as he says in verse 19.”

    The Hebrew phrase ised in 2 Samuel 7:16 is “ad olam” which means as you have stated. There is a condition to the “for ever” dependant upon something. It does not in many cases mean for ever as in eternal. If it were speaking about something such as the Feasts and Sabbaths, the Hebrew phrase for “for ever” is simply the word “olam”. 2 Samuel 7:16’s PROPHECY was about the days that the Messiah will rule from the throne and it will be an everlasting Kingdom. If we read this in context, it is not hard to figure out.

    2Sa 7:12 And WHEN THY DAYS BE FULFILLED, and thou shalt SLEEP WITH THY FATHERS, I will set up THY SEED AFTER THEE, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I WILL ESTABLISH HIS KINGDOM. 13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever(ad olam). 14 I WILL BE HIS FATHER, and HE SHALL BE MY SON. If he commit iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men: 15 But my mercy shall not depart away from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I put away before thee. 16 And thine house and thy kingdom shall be established for ever(ad olam) before thee: thy throne shall be established for ever(ad olam).

    This phrase of “ad olam” is translated as “for ever” yet it is discussing a very specific time, the 1000 year reign of the Messiah. When the wording of “olam” by itself is used, this means it is eternal, for ever, without end, etc.

    H5769
    עלם / עולם
    ‛ôlâm
    BDB Definition:
    1) long duration, antiquity, futurity, for ever, ever, everlasting, evermore, perpetual, old, ancient, world
    1a) ancient time, long time (of past)
    1b) (of future)
    1b1) for ever, always
    1b2) continuous existence, perpetual
    1b3) everlasting, indefinite or unending future, eternity

    Some of the scriptures that use “olam” by itself, meaning without end, eternal, etc.

    Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever(olam):

    This means without end, as if Adam and Eve had not sinned, they would have lived in the Garden with YHVH for ever, for eternity. More scriptures using “olam” by itself.

    Exo 3:15 And Elohim(God) said further to Mosheh, “Thus you are to say to the children of Yisra’ĕl, ‘יהוה Elohim(God) of your fathers, the Elohim(God) of Aḇraham, the Elohim(God) of Yitsḥaq, and the Elohim of Yaʽaqoḇ, has sent me to you. This is My Name forever(olam), and this is My remembrance to all generations.’

    The name of God, YHVH, is eternal. It has no end.

    Exo 12:14 And this(Passover) day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever(olam). 15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel. 16 And in the first day there shall be an holy convocation, and in the seventh day there shall be an holy convocation to you; no manner of work shall be done in them, save that which every man must eat, that only may be done of you. 17 And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever(olam).

    The Hebrew word “olam” is used by itself here, meaning the nature of this command is without end, eternal, never ending, etc. Here are some more places where “olam” is used by itself.

    Now, let us look at the other for ever portion of this command. It is a bit different.

    Exo 12:21 Then Moses called for all the elders of Israel, and said unto them, Draw out and take you a lamb according to your families, and kill the passover. 22 And ye shall take a BUNCH OF HYSSOP, and DIP IT IN THE BLOOD that is in the bason, and strike the lintel and the two side posts with the blood that is in the bason; and none of you shall go out at the door of his house until the morning. 23 For the LORD will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the LORD will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you. 24 And ye shall observe this thing for an ordinance to thee and to thy sons for ever(ad olam).

    This “for ever” command is not eternal, it is not without end, it is based upon a condition, for a certain time until further instruction is given. It is no difference than when we use the words “for ever” as an idiom. We say sentences like, “Man, thius is taking for ever”. It does not mean eternal, it is a certain appointed time based on a condition or until further instruction was given. The command to use the hyssop and dip it in the blood was a command to be observed until the further instruction was given. It was later given just before the Israelites crossed over the Jordan into the Promised Land.

    Deu 12:1 These are the statutes and judgments, which ye shall observe to do IN THE LAND, which the LORD God of thy fathers giveth thee to possess it, all the days that ye live upon the earth. 2 Ye shall utterly destroy all the places, wherein the nations which ye shall possess served their gods, upon the high mountains, and upon the hills, and under every green tree: 3 And ye shall overthrow their altars, and break their pillars, and burn their groves with fire; and ye shall hew down the graven images of their gods, and destroy the names of them out of that place. 4 Ye shall not do so unto the LORD your God. 5 But unto THE PLACE WHERE THE LORD THY GOD WILL CHOOSE out of all your tribes to put his name there, even unto his habitation shall ye seek, and thither thou shalt come: 6 And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks: 7 And there ye shall eat before the LORD your God, and ye shall rejoice in all that ye put your hand unto, ye and your households, wherein the LORD thy God hath blessed thee. 8 Ye SHALL NOT do after all the things that we do here this day, every man whatsoever is right in his own eyes. 9 For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you. 10 BUT WHEN YOU GO OVER THE JORDAN, and dwell in the land which the LORD your God giveth you to inherit, and when he giveth you rest from all your enemies round about, so that ye dwell in safety; 11 THEN THERE SHALL BE A PLACE which the LORD your God shall choose to cause his name to dwell there; thither shall ye bring all that I command you; your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, your tithes, and the heave offering of your hand, and all your choice vows which ye vow unto the LORD: 12 And ye shall rejoice before the LORD your God, ye, and your sons, and your daughters, and your menservants, and your maidservants, and the Levite that is within your gates; forasmuch as he hath no part nor inheritance with you. 13 Take heed to thyself that thou offer not thy burnt offerings in every place that thou seest: 14 But in the place which the LORD shall choose in one of thy tribes, there thou shalt offer thy burnt offerings, and there thou shalt do all that I command thee. 15 Notwithstanding thou mayest kill and eat flesh in all thy gates, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, according to the blessing of the LORD thy God which he hath given thee: the unclean and the clean may eat thereof, as of the roebuck, and as of the hart.

    No longer would the Israelites put the blood upon their doorposts during the Passover, they were only allowed to bring all their offerings and sacrifices to the Priests at the Tabernacle, then the Temple. This is why we do not observe this command today. This is also why the Jews during their dispersia in Babylon did not observe the commandment to put blood upon their doorposts. This commandment was commanded to be done until further instruction was given, in the English it reads “for ever”, but it does not mean for ever as we understand it in the English in some cases such as this one, however, when the word “olam” is used by itself, as with the commands to observe the Sabbaths, Feasts, and to eat clean foods, it does mean eternal, without end, and for ever as we understand it in the English language. On to point number 2.

    “2 The Bible itself says that the feasts will be cut off
    a. Daniel 9:25-27 speaking of Jesus’ coming and the aftermath. “25 Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble. 26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ HE WILL PUT AN END TO SACRIFICE AND OFFERING. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.”

    I agree he put an end to sacrifice and used the Roman army to destroy the Temple, but that does not mean the Temple will not be rebuilt and the offerings and sacrifices won’t continue as recorded in the Book of Ezekiel, chapters 40-48. Suddenly, things that were “ad olam” or not eternal, become “olam” and eternal in the scriptures in the Book of Ezekiel. The appointed times for the offerings and sacrifices, as well as the Priesthood, are no longer based upon a condition, but they are based upon a promise, and are eternal in nature.

    Eze 43:7 And he said unto me, Son of man, THE PLACE OF MY THRONE, and the place of the soles of my feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel FOR EVER(olam, eternal, without end), and my holy name, shall the house of Israel NO MORE DEFILE, neither they, nor their kings, by their whoredom, nor by the carcases of their kings in their high places. 8 In their setting of their threshold by my thresholds, and their post by my posts, and the wall between me and them, they have even defiled my holy name by their abominations that they have committed: wherefore I have consumed them in mine anger. 9 Now let them put away their whoredom, and the carcases of their kings, far from me, and I will dwell in the midst of them for ever(Olam, eternal, without end). 10 Thou son of man, shew the house to the house of Israel, that they may be ashamed of their iniquities: AND LET THEM MEASURE THE PATTERN. 11 And if they be ashamed of all that they have done, shew them the form of the house, and the fashion thereof, and the goings out thereof, and the comings in thereof, and all the forms thereof, and all the ordinances thereof, and all the forms thereof, and all the laws thereof: and write it in their sight, that they may keep the whole form thereof, and all the ordinances thereof, and do them. 12 This is the law of the house; Upon the top of the mountain the whole limit thereof round about shall be most holy. Behold, this is the law of the house. 13 And these are the measures of the altar after the cubits: The cubit is a cubit and an hand breadth; even the bottom shall be a cubit, and the breadth a cubit, and the border thereof by the edge thereof round about shall be a span: and this shall be the higher place of the altar. 14 And from the bottom upon the ground even to the lower settle shall be two cubits, and the breadth one cubit; and from the lesser settle even to the greater settle shall be four cubits, and the breadth one cubit. 15 So the altar shall be four cubits; and from the altar and upward shall be four horns. 16 And the altar shall be twelve cubits long, twelve broad, square in the four squares thereof. 17 And the settle shall be fourteen cubits long and fourteen broad in the four squares thereof; and the border about it shall be half a cubit; and the bottom thereof shall be a cubit about; and his stairs shall look toward the east. 18 And he said unto me, Son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; These are the ordinances of the altar in the day when they shall make it, to OFFER BURNT OFFERINGS thereon, and to sprinkle blood thereon. 19 And thou shalt give to the priests the Levites that be of the seed of Zadok, which approach unto me, to minister unto me, saith the Lord GOD, a young bullock for a sin offering. 20 And thou shalt take of the blood thereof, and put it on the four horns of it, and on the four corners of the settle, and upon the border round about: thus shalt thou cleanse and purge it. 21 Thou shalt take the bullock also of the sin offering, and he shall burn it in the appointed place of the house, without the sanctuary. :22 And on the second day thou shalt offer a kid of the goats without blemish for a sin offering; and they shall cleanse the altar, as they did cleanse it with the bullock. 23 When thou hast made an end of cleansing it, thou shalt offer a young bullock without blemish, and a ram out of the flock without blemish. 24 And thou shalt offer them before the LORD, and the priests shall cast salt upon them, and they shall offer them up for a burnt offering unto the LORD. 25 Seven days shalt thou prepare every day a goat for a sin offering: they shall also prepare a young bullock, and a ram out of the flock, without blemish. 26 Seven days shall they purge the altar and purify it; and they shall consecrate themselves. 27 And when these days are expired, it shall be, that upon the eighth day, and so forward, the priests shall make your burnt offerings upon the altar, and your peace offerings; and I will accept you, saith the Lord GOD.

    There is only one time that God(YHVH) will dwell among men for ever.

    Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, THE TABERNACLE OF GOD IS WITH MEN, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be NO MORE DEATH, NIETHER SORROW, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the FORMER THINGS HAVE PASSED AWAY.

    So, we can see that certain parts of the sacrificial system would be done only during their appointed times, and were not eternal at that time, nor this time, but in the future, it will be eternal. This right here is exactly why Yeshua/Jesus said that Heaven and Earth must pass away before one jot or tittle could be removed from the law. All the commands to observe the Feasts are eternal, even though parts of their observances cannot at this time be observed due to us not having a Temple and we do not live in the Land. We cannot observe the sacrificial portions of the Torah/Law, but that does not mean there won’t be a day when we will be observing them, in Jerusalem. There will be consequinces for forsaking the Feast of Tabernacles during the reign of Messiah.

    Zec 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem(AFTER ARMEGEDDON) shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, AND TO KEEP THE FEAST OF TABERNACLES. 17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of ALL THE FAMILIES OF THE EARTH unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be NO RAIN. 18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. 19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment OF ALL NATIONS that come not up TO KEEP THE FEAST OF TABERNACLES.

    Paul continued to offer sacrifices long after his conversion as well, because the Temple was there standing and he could observe that portion of the Torah/Law. He did a Nazarite Vow, on the commission of James and the elders, along with four other men to prove that he himself was living in observance of the Torah/Law. This is one of the times Paul was FALSELY accused of teaching against the Torah/Law.

    Act 21:18 The next day Paul went with us to visit James, and all the elders were present. 19 After greeting them, Paul related one by one the things that God had done among the gentiles through his ministry. 20 When they heard about it, they praised God and told him, “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and all of them are zealous for the law. 21 But they have been told about you-that you teach all the Jews living among the gentiles toFORSAKE THE LAW OF MOSES, and that you TELL THEM NOT TO CIRCUMCISE THEIR CHILDREN or observe the customs. 22 What is to be done? They will certainly hear that you have come. 23 So do what we tell you. We have four men who are under a vow(Nazarite Vow, Num. 6). 24 Take these men, go through the purification ceremony with them, and pay the expenses to shave their heads. Then everyone will know that THERE IS NOTHING in what they have been told about you, but that YOU YOURSELF CONSTANTLY GUARD AND OBSERVE THE LAW.

    Again Paul was FALSELY accused of the same, and he gives us his statement of faith.

    Act 24:14 However, I admit to you that in accordance with the Way, which they call a heresy, I worship the God of our ancestors AND BELIEVE EVERYTHING WRITTEN IN THE LAW AND IN THE PROPHETS. 15 I have the same hope in God that they themselves cherish-that there is to be a resurrection of the righteous and the wicked. 16 Therefore, I always do my best to have a clear conscience in the sight of God and people. 17 After many years I have come back to my people to bring gifts for the poor and to OFFER SACRIFICES. 18 They found me IN THE TEMPLE doing these things just as I had completed the purification ceremony. No crowd or noisy mob was present.

    Some will argue this is a bloodless sacrifice, but the word in Greek is “προσφορά, prosphora”, the same Greek word used to describe the Messiah’s sacrifice in Hebrews 10:10, which was no doubt a blood sacrifice. Now, on the point C of 2.

    “c. Hebrews 9:8-9 says “In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.”

    If one has a change in a contract, he does not write up a new contract, he simply changes what needs to be changed. What am I saying, that the commandment needed changing? May it NEVER be, but the application changes. What does this mean? Even though we have the command to the Sons of Aaron to do the commandments pertaining to the High Priest, we know that Priesthood was not an eternal Priesthood. The commandments are still done, but by our High Priest, Yeshua/Jesus Messiah. He still has to offer the oblations in the Heavenly Tabernacle. The commandment does not disappear, it is only applicable to the Messiah from now on. Paul tells us plainly and in a worldly manner that once something is ratified, it cannot be annulled or changed.

    Gal 3:11 Now it is obvious that no one is justified in the sight of God by the law, because “The righteous will live by faith.” 12 But the law has nothing to do with faith. Instead, “The person who keeps the commandments WILL HAVE LIFE IN THEM.” 13 Christ redeemed us FROM THE CURSE (not the blessings)of the law by becoming a curse for us. For it is written, “A curse on everyone who is hung on a tree!” 14 This happened in order that the blessing promised to Abraham would come to the gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith. 15 Brothers, let me use an example from everyday life. Once a person’s will has been ratified, NO ONE CAN CANCEL IT OR ADD TO IT. 16 Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his descendant. It doesn’t say “descendants,” referring to many, but “your descendant,” referring to one person, who is Christ. 17 This is what I mean: The law that came 430 years later DID NOT CANCEL THE COVENANT PREVIOUSLY RATIFIED BY GOD so as to nullify the promise.

    We have a New Covenant, in which the Law is to be written on our hearts. The Law did not change, just the place where it was written.

    Jer 31:31 “Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will make a NEW COVENANT with THE HOUSE OF ISRAELAND THE HOUSE OF JUDAH, 32 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the LORD. 33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW(Hebrew word is Torah), and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

    As we teach, the evidence of our Faith and of the evidence that the Law is written on our hearts is IF we do the righteous requirements of the law.

    Rom 2:11 For GodDOES NOT SHOW PARTIALITY. 12 For all who have sinned apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not merely those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight. No, it is those WHO DO THE LAW, WHO WILL BE JUSTIFIED. 14 For whenever >>>GENTILES<<<, who do not possess the law, DO INSTINCTIVELY WHAT THE LAW REQUIRES, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They SHOW WHAT THE LAW REQUIRES IS WRITTEN ON THEIR HEARTS, a fact to which their own consciences testify, and their thoughts will either accuse or excuse them 16 on that day when God, through Jesus Christ, will judge people's secrets according to my gospel.

    We have a New Covenant, a New High Priest, but the same Law/Torah/Instructions in righteousness. The commandments have not and will not change, just the applications. The commandment will continue until Heaven and Earth pass, after the 1000 year reign of Messiah and the last rebellion of Satan occurs. I hope you better understand these things now. I pray you will start looking deeper and judge not according to the appearance, but weigh what is said, you will find that the scriptures cannot contradict and teaching that any portion of the law has changed is basically teaching against the entire law, Prophets, Writings, Gospels, and Epistles. I pray you will weigh what I have presented, Shalom.

  13. My goodness, that was a lot of words to read. 1st off, very well presented Eric and David. I will do what I can to address all your points, though you do not seem to do so to mine (I’m still waiting for a response on the actual rapture ones, u responded to like one of them).

    David, I have a few points to make
    1 I will use the handy number pad to make this less wordy because y’all gave me a lot of points to cover
    2 Forever still implies a very long time in this context. The Hebrew word owlam (Strong’s H5769) can mean for a long duration (in fact if you look it up on blue letter bible for a long duration is the first definition) is used in many scriptures in the context of “a very long time”
    a. Exodus 14:13 “And Moses said unto the people, Fear ye not, stand still, and see the salvation of the LORD, which he will shew to you to day: for the Egyptians whom ye have seen to day, ye shall see them again no more for ever.” Israel has certainly seen (Hebrew: ra’ah, literally see/percieve) the Egyptians since then.
    b. Exodus 40:15 “And thou shalt anoint them, as thou didst anoint their father, that they may minister unto me in the priest’s office: for their anointing shall surely be an everlasting priesthood throughout their generations.” Not endless, I do not see priests anointed in the office of a priest nowadays. (correct me if I’m wrong, I might be)
    c. 1 Kings 8:13 “I have surely built thee an house to dwell in, a settled place for thee to abide in for ever.” Speaking on the temple. NEWS FLASH there is no temple there any more, there hasn’t been for ~2500 or so years.
    d. and many more, but I don’t have time to do them all
    3 Good point about me adding or taking away from God’s word, I didn’t think of that *initiate the slow clap* just remember the same warning goes to you
    4 Even if the it was just the sacrifices and oblations that ceased when the temple was destroyed. SOMETHING IS STILL CEASING
    5 It is finished, I was never taught what I said, it just seemed to be a remarkable coincidence that I saw when I was researching. However, what is the significance of thee veil being torn, still a rather remarkable coincidence. Matthew doesn’t even mentioned Jesus saying It is finished, it just mentions the torn veil, as if they are the same. Coincidence, I think not.
    6 In Hebrews 8:8-12 God speaks on the new covenant and says “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:” The new covenant is the one written in their hearts.
    7 I agree with most of what you say on Acts 15, however if you decide to address anything I say in this comment, answer me this: what do you mean by “have to”
    8 Final point for the David-man, yes this is a tennis match I do it because it is fun, and I hope we both realize that we will not convince the other of our points, I am firm in my beliefs, I don’t even give you all the points on a topic because I do not have the time or energy. I would appreciate a Bible-reading plan, I’ve been trying to do it on my own, it works ok, but for the busier days a schedule would definately be helpful. If it is not trouble to you (I seriously don’t care, I could track one down pretty easily)

    Okay Eric’s turn(er), (haha get it?)

    1 I agree with you on what you sat about forever, and actually I agree with you on a lot of things, well presented sir, however, I will address your points you made on the June 2nd first.
    a. Okay, I have addressed this point before, the sign of ones salvation is his works it is (here we go again) LOVE inspired Obedience
    b. I agree here as well, in fact I have already said so, yes Jesus did not abolish the law, in case you didn’t catch it I KNOW THAT LAW/TORAH = GOOD AND TO BE LOVE inspired OBEYED (again!), you say so yourself in a later comment that the feasts and sacrifices are not practical, nor commanded of us NOW. Yes we WILL IN THE MILLENIAL KINGDOM. I agree whole-heartedly with that.
    c. Great point about the proverbs for parable interpretation, I did not know that, however If it is a parable it should be treated as such(use the ultimate proverbs parable-understandifier 31) but if it is not, THEN A NON PARABLE PASSAGE SHOULD NOT BE TREATED AS SUCH
    2 I totally agree with what you say on forever, in fact you probably used the same website as I did
    3 Yes I agree with you again, no law has changed however, the feasts and sacrifices are no longer in use today as told by God
    a. I have already said why in a previous comment
    4 What does Shalom mean. I know it’s a type of farewell, but does it have kindof a God Bless, meaning or something, just curious.

    I hope we both know that neither of us is going to convince the other of the other’s standpoint. I am firmly planted in my belief in a pre-trib rapture and will shortly write a comment on it and y’all can try to tear it to shreds, by saying that I am twisting scripture etc etc.

    Good night and Farewell,

    Tomathy

    • Tomathy, what is the length of time you want in weeks and how many days per week for the reading schedule? Do you want the Apocrypha included or excluded? Once I have this information, it will take me a bit to list the daily books and chapters for you to read.

      Now, something you are missing in your definition for the Hebrew word H5769 olam is that it also means eternal or perpetual. Since this is the word that was used for the feasts, your theological perspective is in conflict against the Scriptures. After Yeshua died, was buried, resurrected and ascended, there are many references where the apostles observed the feasts including Passover, Weeks and Tabernacles.

      As for the veil tearing, all this proves is what is written in Hebrews 7-8, where the priesthood was transferred to Yeshua. Remember what Deuteronomy 4:2 and 12:32 says, which is directly related to what is written in Matthew 5:17-18. Revelation 21:1 is the fulfillment of this reference.

      As for there being no temple, are you forgetting that your physical body is the temple of the Holy Spirit?

  14. Eric- I NEVER said that the Sabbaths and Feasts could not be observed now, I showed how the Sabbath is commanded “olam”, or everlasting, without end, and perpetual. We are just as the Jews were without a Temple when they returned from Babylon. BEFORE YHVH would allow the second Temple to be built, he addressed the Sabbath issue.

    Neh 13:16 There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem. 17 Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What EVIL THING is this that ye do, AND PROFANE THE SABBATH DAY? 18 Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet YE BRING MORE WRATH UPON ISRAEL BY PROFANING THE SABBATH DAY. 19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.

    What was once evil then cannot be made good now, so profaning the Sabbath is still an act of EVIL. The Messiah told us plainly,

    Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

    What is evil cannot be counted as anything else but evil. You stated that what is not a Parable should not be interpreted as a Parable. When it is OBVIOUSLY a Parable, we should use the keys we were given, the Proverbs. The Parable I cited was,

    Mat 5:14 “You are the LIGHT of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives light to all in the house. 16 In the same way, let your LIGHT shine before others, so that they may see your GOOD WORKS and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.

    This is obviously a parable. Please go back and study the parable. What I cannot understand is how you can say Law,Moses=GOOD and yet still continue in not observing even the Ten Commandments. The Sabbath commandment is the fourth of the Ten. Tell me, which Prophet EVER spoke of the Sabbath not being observed? Breaking the law is sin(1 John 3:4) and there is no new law as you stated.

    Joh 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, MY DOCTRINE IS NOT MINE, but his that sent me. 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself. 18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him. 19 Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

    How can people say that Yeshua/Jesus brought some new law? Show me just one new commandment in the entire New Testament. I will show every single commandment that is spoken in the New Testament in the Old Testament. You start changing definitions of what God’s law is and you add to or take away from it. The law has a clause as most legal documents do, that says if anyone adds to or takes away from it, they are in violation. How can you accuse the Messiah of breaking this command? If he did break this command and add to or take away from the law, he cannot be the true Messiah. I know what you are thinking now so I will explain now. In Matthew 5, it SEEMS as if Yeshua/Jesus is adding to Moses, but this is NOT the case, he was doing something that was Prophesied he would do by the Prophet Isaiah. Right after Yeshua/Jesus says the exact same thing that the law states about adding to or taking away from the law when he said, “those who do and teach the least of the commandments shall be great in the Kingdom of Heaven. Those who do not teach and do the least of the commandments, they will be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven”, he SEEMINGLY adds some new concepts to Moses, but he was not adding to Moses, he was MAGNIFYING Moses, meaning, he was making the commandment Moses gave stronger and even more strict than before.

    Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: 22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. 23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee; 24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift. 25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison. 26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing. 27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: 28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

    It was Isaiah that Prophesied that he would MAGNIFY the Law.

    Isa 42:20 Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not. 21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness’ sake; HE WILL MAGNIFY THE LAW, AND MAKE IT HONORABLE. 22 But this is a people robbed and spoiled; they are all of them snared in holes, and they are hid in prison houses: they are for a prey, and none delivereth; for a spoil, and none saith, Restore. 23 Who among you will give ear to this? who will hearken and hear for the time to come? 24 Who gave Jacob for a spoil, and Israel to the robbers? did not the LORD, he against whom we have sinned? for they would not walk in his ways, neither were they obedient unto his law. 25 Therefore he hath poured upon him the fury of his anger, and the strength of battle: and it hath set him on fire round about, yet he knew not; and it burned him, yet he laid it not to heart.

    Yeshua/Jesus was magnifying the law, he was not changing it or taking away from part of it, he was not adding to it. He was doing as he was prophesied concerning what he would teach concerning the law. He told us plainly that he did not come to abolish the law but to “fulfill”. One of the definitions for “pleroo”, the Greek word used for “fulfill” is to fill with meaning or to “fully preach” the law as he was prophesied to do. I know you say that you do not believe he abolished the law, so that means you understand the law to still be binding. If it was not, we have no sin and therefor need no Messiah. If you believe the law to still be binding and that it is written on your heart, why do you so adamantly speak against portions of it? This is not the fruit that the Holy Spirit produces, the Holy Spirit leads the believer into observance of the commandments.

    Eze 36:26 A NEW HEART also will I give you, and a NEW SPIRIT will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, AND CAUSE YOU TO WALK IN MY STATUTES, AND YE SHALL KEEP MY JUDGMENTS, and do them.

    The fact that you are preaching against the least of the commandments is a testimony that you do not have them written on your heart, as what comes from our heart will be cast forth out of our mouths.

    Mat 12:34 You brood of vipers! How can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35 The good person out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil person out of his evil treasure brings forth evil. 36 I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak, 37 for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

    When you speak against the Sabbath, the “wedding ring” of the Covenant, you are speaking EVIL things as pointed out above. You are teaching lawlessness. You are teaching against the greatest commandment.

    Mar 12:28 And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him, “Which commandment is the most important of all?” 29 Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. 30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’

    Here Yeshua/Jesus is quoting from the Shema. The word for “hear” in Hebrew is “shema” and it means to “hear, see, meditate, understand, then do”. He did not give you the entire commandment though. If we read what he is quoting, we will see WHY it is the greatest commandment.

    Deu 6:4 “Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one. 5 You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6 And these words that I command you today shall be IN YOUR HEART. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

    This is a perfect example of the difference between a commandment and Torah/instructions.

    What does it mean when the Messiah says this?

    Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
    38 This is the first and great commandment 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Many say that all we have to do is love God and Love our neighbor, no need to eat Kosher, no need to keep the Sabbaths, no need to observe YHVH’s Appointed Feast days, no need to do anything other than love God and love our neighbor. Well, we do need to do both these things, but how do we do that? The Ten Commandments can be summed up in these Two. The First 4 tell us how to love God, the last 6 tell us how to love our neighbor. We have initial commandments, the Two Greatest, and the Ten “hang from them” or can be summarized by them. The Torah/Law hang from the Ten. How does this work?

    Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. (INITIAL COMMAND)

    Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

    Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

    Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.(INSTRUCTIONS/TORAH on HOW TO KEEP THE SABBATH HOLY)

    Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. (INITIAL COMMAND)6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.8 And thou shalt BIND THEM AS A SIGN ON THY HAND, AND THEY SHALL BE AS FRONTLETS BETWEEN THINE EYES.9 And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.(TORAH/INSTRUCTIONS on HOW TO LOVE YHVH)

    The word for “sign” here is

    H226
    אות
    ‘ôth
    oth
    Probably from H225 (in the sense of appearing); a signal (literally or figuratively), as a flag, beacon, monument, omen, prodigy, evidence, etc.: – MARK, miracle, (en-) sign, token.

    So, we all know that the “mark of the beast” goes in the Hand on the forehead, but now we see contained within the greatest commandment that the mark or sign of YHVH/God also is bound to the hand and forehead. The same word “oth” is used when speaking of the Sabbath. YHVH/God says it is his sign or mark so that we know it is he who sanctifies us.

    Exo 31:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for IT IS A SIGN between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. 14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. 16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL(olam, without end, eternal) COVENANT. 17 It is A SIGN between me and the children of Israel for ever(olam, without end, eternal, perpetual): for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

    The Sabbath command is different than any of the other 9 Commandments. It is a COVENANT that is FOR EVER, a sign of YHVH/God’s authority between Him and His people. This is THE SIGN that Israel broke constantly and caused them to be dispersed. The House of Judah(The Jewish People) was guilty of the same. Both the House of Israel and the House of Judah were dispersed for breaking the Sabbaths and worshipping YHVH/God in the same manner as the Pagans worshipped their gods. Keeping the Sabbath is directly tied to Salvation. WHAT??????!!!!!! BLASPHEMY!!!!!!! LOL! Seriously, it is directly tied to Salvation. Christians openly admit this without even understanding what they are saying. They understand one aspect of the Sabbath that it is a shadow of the 1000 year Sabbath of the Mellinium, but what they do not understand is breaking the Sabbath is still punishable by death, specifically stoning. Will there be a stoning of Sabbath breakers, Adulterous men and women, and disobedient Sons? You bet there will be.

    Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent(100 pounds): and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.

    We are commanded in Hebrews 4 to keep the weekly Sabbaths. The problem of these verses is the fact that there is no punctuation in Greek or Hebrew, so the translators must add punctuation to the sentences. If the wrong punctuation is used, it can make the translation inaccurate. Let us look at this for a minute. Hebrews 4 is an extension of the previous chapter. Why they put a chapter break here is beyond my comprehension, so let us put this in context shall we.

    Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; 15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation(rebellion in the wilderness after the Israelites left Egypt). 16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke(rebell): howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. 17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest(katapausis), but to them that believed not? 19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest(katapausis), any of you should seem to come short of it. 2 For unto us WAS THE GOSPEL PREACHED, AS WELL AS UNTO THEM(those who left Egypt): but the word preached did not profit them, NOT BEING MIXED WITH FAITH in them that heard it. 3 For we which have believed do enter into rest(katapausis), as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest(katapausis): although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4 For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And God did rest(katapauō) THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works. 5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest(katapausis). 6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief: 7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts(Psalm read in the Temple every Sabbath, the Seventh Day). 8 For IF JESUS HAD GIVEN THEM REST(katapauō), then WOULD HE NOT AFTERWARD SPOKEN OF ANOTHER DAY. 9 There remaineth therefore a rest(sabbatismos) to the people of God. 10 For he that is entered into his rest(katapausis), he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. 11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest(katapausis), LEST ANY MAN FALL INTO THE SAME EXAMPLE OF UNBELIEF. 12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

    First, we need to understand that there are three Greek words used for one English word for “rest”. Let us define these in their original language so we can get the correct idea and teaching.

    G2663
    κατάπαυσις
    katapausis
    kat-ap’-ow-sis
    From G2664; reposing down, that is, (by Hebraism) abode: – rest.

    This is a physical rest, refraining from any labour. The next word is from the same root and basically means the same thing.

    G2664
    καταπαύω
    katapauō
    Thayer Definition:
    1) to make quiet, to cause to be at rest, to grant rest
    1a) to lead to a quiet abode
    1b) to still, restrain, to cause (one striving to do something) to desist
    2) to rest, take rest

    The third word used for “rest” is “sabbatismos” and has a very different meaning. This is found in verse 9 of chapter 4. This word should not have ever been translated as “rest” as it is in the KJV. Here is the definition.

    G4520
    σαββατισμός
    sabbatismos
    Thayer Definition:
    1) a keeping of the sabbath
    2) the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by the true worshippers of God and true Christians

    It should read, “there remains therefor a keeping of the Sabbath for the people of God”. Some translations got it pretty close.

    (The Scriptures 1998+) So there remains a Sabbath-keeping for the people of Elohim.

    (NET) Consequently a Sabbath rest remains for the people of God.

    (ASV) There remaineth therefore a sabbath rest for the people of God.

    (ESV) So then, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God,

    (YLT) there doth remain, then, a sabbatic rest to the people of God,

    (LBP) It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the Sabbath.

    (ANT) then is left Rest (Weekly) [for] the people [of] the god

    (EMTV) Then there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.

    (ISV) There remains, therefore, a Sabbath rest for the people of God.

    Notice first off it does not say there remains a keeping of the Sabbath for Israel, it says for the “people of God”. Israel was only the tool in which YHVH would use to bring all Nations into His Covenant. This is the only place in all of scripture that the word “sabbatismos” is used. The next issue I would like to point out is that according to the author of Hebrews, the same Gospel was preached to them that left Egypt that was preached to the Apostles and Disciples of Yeshua/Jesus. It also tells us not to follow “the same example of unbelief”. What was this example of unbelief he is speaking of concerning the people who left Egypt concerning the Sabbath days?

    Num 15:32 And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. 33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35 And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.

    The next point I would like to make at this time is there is no sacrifice for wilfull and rebellious sin.

    Heb 10:26 For if we sin(transgress the law, 1 John 3:4) wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SIN, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. 28 He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

    This is commentary on the verses I just quoted giving the example of unbelief the children of Israel were guilty of concerning the Sabbaths.

    Num 15:27 And if any soul sin through ignorance, then he shall bring a she goat of the first year for a sin offering. 28 And the priest shall make an atonement for the soul that sinneth ignorantly, when he sinneth by ignorance before the LORD, to make an atonement for him; and it shall be forgiven him. 29 Ye shall have ONE LAW for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, AND FOR THE STRANGER that sojourneth among them. 30 But the soul that DOETH OUGHT PRESUMPTUOUSLY, whether he be born in the land, or a stranger, the same reproacheth the LORD; and that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 31 Because he hath despised the word of the LORD, AND HATH BROKEN HIS COMMANDMENT, that soul shall utterly be cut off; his iniquity shall be upon him. 32 And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. 33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35 And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.

    There are three types of sin, some are forgivable, some lead to death and are not forgiven.

    Pesha (deliberate sin; in modern Hebrew: crime) or Mered (lit.: rebellion) – An intentional sin; an action committed in deliberate defiance of God; (Strong’s Concordance :H6588 (פשע pesha’, peh’shah). According to Strong it comes from the root (:H6586); rebellion, transgression, trespass.

    Avon (lit.: iniquity) – This is a sin of lust or uncontrollable emotion. It is a sin done knowingly, but not done to defy God; (Strong’s Concordance :H5771 (avon, aw-vone). According to Strong it comes from the root (:H5753); meaning perversity, moral evil:–fault, iniquity, mischief.

    Cheit – This is an unintentional sin, crime or fault. (Strong’s Concordance :H2399 (חַטָּא chate). According to Strong it comes from the root khaw-taw (:H2398, H2403) meaning “to miss, to err from the mark (speaking of an archer), to sin, to stumble.”

    The sin of “pasha” is not atoned for by the Messiah’s blood. This is wilfull sin done in direct defiance of God. The example is given just after Moses commands the Israelites in the atonement process. A man is gathering sticks on the Sabbath even though he had knowledge of the truth, that those who profane the Sabbath shall be put to death. The man acted in direct defiance of God. He was stoned outside the camp. A New Testament death sentence for direct defiance of God can be found in Acts 5.

    Act 5:1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession, 2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles’ feet. 3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? 4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God. 5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things. 6 And the young men arose, wound him up, and carried him out, and buried him. 7 And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what was done, came in. 8 And Peter answered unto her, Tell me whether ye sold the land for so much? And she said, Yea, for so much. 9 Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord? behold, the feet of them which have buried thy husband are at the door, and shall carry thee out. 10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband. 11 And great fear came upon all the church, and upon as many as heard these things. 12 And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon’s porch. 13 And of the rest durst no man join himself to them: but the people magnified them. 14 And believers were the more added to the Lord, multitudes both of men and women.)

    This man and woman lied and bore false witness in direct defiance of the commandment and they were put to death for their rebellion. The next issue I would like to point out is in Hebrews 4, verse 8, there is a translation issue. Remember, Greek has no punctuations, so the translators have to add punctuation. When the wrong punctuation is used, it can change the meaning of the verse, even the entire Chapter. Look closely:

    Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then WOULD HE NOT afterward have spoken of another day.

    Why is there a period at the end of this sentence? He is asking a question. If we fix the punctuation of this verse, and correctly translate the word “sabbatismos” in verse 9, it becomes clear that in the New Testament we have a direct commandment to observe the Seventh Day Sabbaths. If we correctly translate these verses and put the correct punctuation there, it should read:

    Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day?
    9 There remaineth therefore a keeping of the Sabbath to the people of God.

    You made comment that I probably use the same websites as you, but what I do is actually study both Hebrew and Greek so that I can find these translation flaws. We must pay close attention because it was prophesied by the Prophet Jeremiah that there would be faulty translations and falsely scribed scriptures, so the utmost diligence should be used.

    Jer 8:8 “How can you say, ‘We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us’? But behold, the lying pen of the scribes has made it into a lie.”

    We must do as the Bereans and search the scriptures daily to make sure what we are understanding is true, and what our teachers are teaching is true. If we find error in teachers, it should be addressed according to the scriptures. No teacher is perfect so we all need each other so that we may all be of one accord and of one voice and one speech, not teaching 38,000 differing doctrines of Protestant Christianity and searching for the good doctrine. The good doctrine is what will bring us all into one accord.

    Pro 4:2 For I give you good doctrine, forsake ye not my law.

    I can go into any synagogue in the World, to Messianic Synagogues of believers, or of the Orthodox Jews who do not believe, and Worldwide, we are studying the same scriptures every week, and the liturgy done during the Shabbat services are pretty much the same, other than minor details. This is what the Prophet spoke of when he wrote:

    Zep 3:8 Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.
    Zep 3:9 For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent.

    How does this happen? Hebrew in the early 1800’s was almost a dead language, only a few people on earth could speak Hebrew. Now there are Millions, and most of them are “Gentiles” who have been grafted into the Olive Tree which is Israel. Paul tells us the same, to be of one speech and one voice, not divided into 38,000 denominations with varying and ever changing doctrines based on traditions of men.

    1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. 12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. 13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius; 15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.

    The Apostle is rebuking the Church at Corinth for the very practices of modern Western Christianity. We are supposed to be speaking the same things and agreeing with one another, not creating a denomination based on traditional pet doctrines that have absolutely no substance. Churches are whitewashed tombs, beautiful on the outside but full of dead men’s bones. In some denominations, this is literal, there are actual dead men’s bones under the altar. When I first started this long explaination mainly of the Sabbath, I said it is directly tied to Salvation. I have given you many scriptures that speak of judgment for breaking the Sabbaths, so allow me to leave you with a promise and the very reason I sais keeping the Sabbath is directly tied to Salvation.

    Isa 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: FOR MY SALVATION(Hebrew word for Salvation is Yeshua) IS NEAR TO COME, and my righteousness to be revealed. 2 BLESSED IS THE MAN THAT DOETH THIS, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil. 3 Neither let the SON OF THE STRANGER(Gentiles), that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree. 4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 6 Also the SONS OF THE STRANGERS(Gentiles), that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; 7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful IN MY HOUSE(Temple)of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. 8 The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.

    Here we have a promise of YHVH/God that those who keep the Sabbath from polluting it, that we will be blessed and be able to enter His House and will be given names better than Sons and Daughters. This is a Promise to them that are entering the Mellinial Age, the 7000th year from Creation, the 1000 year Sabbath, will receive blessings for keeping the Sabbaths. There are other promises made for them that keep the Sabbaths.

    Isa 58:10 And if thou draw out thy soul to the hungry, and satisfy the afflicted soul; then shall thy light rise in obscurity, and thy darkness be as the noonday: 11 And the LORD shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought, and make fat thy bones: and thou shalt be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters fail not. 12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in. 13 IF THOU TURN AWAY THY FOOT FROM THE SABBATH , from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; AND CALL THE SABBATH A DELIGHT, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: 14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

    Here is yet another promise to them that keep the Sabbaths. In Isaiah 56, it included the Gentiles who are Grafted into the House of Israel. If you are Yeshua/Jesus’s, you are adopted into the House of Israel. He sais it himself, he only came for the lost sheep of the House of Israel.

    Mat 15:23 But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. 24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

    We are told by Paul that when we are redeemed into Yeshua/Jesus, we are no longer Gentiles, but fellow heirs according to the promise.

    Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus UNTO GOOD WORKS, WHICH GOD HATH BEFORE ORDAINED THAT WE SHOULD WALK IN THEM(What are these “good works” that God has beforehand ordained that e should walk in them?). 11 Wherefore remember, that ye BEING IN TIMES PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants(plural) of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath MADE BOTH ONE, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the LAW OF COMMANDMENTS CONTAINED IN ORDINANCES; for to make in himself of twain ONE NEW MAN, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. 18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. 19 Now therefore YE ARE NO MORE STRANGERS AND FOREIGHNERS, BUT FELLOW CITIZENS WITH THE SAINTS, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

    You ARE Israel. You have entered into the New Covenant that was made with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. The Greek word for “ordinances” in these verses is “dogma”.

    G1378
    δόγμα
    dogma
    dog’-mah
    From the base of G1380; a law (civil, ceremonial or ecclesiastical): – decree, ordinance.

    These commandments and decrees do not come from God, but from the ekklesia, or the assembly. They are not commandments of God, and are never in the scriptures used in conjunction with the commandments of God. Every time the word “dogma” is used in scripture it is always a man made decree.

    G1378
    δόγμα
    dogma
    Total KJV Occurrences: 5
    decrees, 2
    Act_16:4, Act_17:7
    ordinances, 2
    Eph_2:15, Col_2:14
    decree, 1
    Luk_2:1

    It is the same in Col. 2. The only difference is in Col. 2, the context reveals that they are commandments of men directly, both above and below the verse in question.

    Col 2:8 BEWARE LEST ANY MAN SPOIL YOU THROUGH PHILOSOPHY AND VAIN DECEIT , after the TRADITIONS OF MEN, after the RUDIMENTS OF THIS WORLD, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: 11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 BLOTTING OUT THE HANDWRITING OF ORDINANCES THAT WAS AGAINST US, which WAS CONTRARY TO US, and took it out of the way, NAILING IT TO THE CROSS; 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. 18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his FLESHLY MIND, 19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the RUDIMENTS OF THIS WORLD, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
    Col 2:22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the COMMANDMENTS AND DOCTRINES OF MEN?
    Col 2:23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the SATISFYING OF THE FLESH.

    We can see when read in context, it is quite clearly speaking of the ordinances of men, traditions of men, and rudiments of this world. It is NOT talking about the commandments of God. Verse 16 should make perfect sense if you knew the context of the times. Unbelieving Jews, some Pharisees, some Saducees, some zealots, did not approve of Gentiles observing the Sabbaths, Feasts, and circumcising their children. It is written in their law, not God’s law, that Gentiles, even them that believe in YHVH, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, should not be observing these things because they were given to Israel alone, not to Gentiles. Sound familiar????????? You guys are obeying the traditions of the Pharisees, and rejecting the commandment of YHVH/God. Just as the 7th Day Sabbath is a sign or mark of YHVH’s Authority, the observance of Sunday is the sign of mark of authority of the Roman Catholic Church. They boast this pretty boldly.

    Cardinal James Gibbons, The Faith of Our Fathers (Ayers Publishing, 1978): 108:

    “But you may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify.”

    Chancellor Albert Smith for Cardinal of Baltimore Archdiocese, letter dated February 10, 1920:
    “If Protestants would follow the Bible, they should worship God on the Sabbath day by God is Saturday. In keeping the Sunday, they are following a law of the Catholic Church.”

    Stephen Keenan, Catholic—Doctrinal Catechism 3rd Edition: 174:
    Question: Have you any other way of proving the Church has power to institute festivals of precept?

    Answer: Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her, she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the 1st day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the 7th day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority.

    Our Sunday Visitor (February 5, 1950):

    “Practically everything Protestants regard as essential or important they have received from the Catholic Church… The Protestant mind does not seem to realize that in accepting the Bible and observing the Sunday, in keeping Christmas and Easter, they are accepting the authority of the spokesman for the church, the Pope.”

    Louis Gaston Segur, Plain Talk about the Protestantism of To-Day (London: Thomas Richardson and Son, 1874): 213:

    “Thus the observance of Sunday by the Protestants is a homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the (Catholic) Church.”

    Catholic Priest T. Enright, CSSR, Kansas City, MO:

    “It was the holy Catholic Church that changed the day of rest from Saturday to Sunday, the 1st day of the week. And it not only compelled all to keep Sunday, but at the Council of Laodicea, AD 364, anathematized those who kept the Sabbath and urged all persons to labor on the 7th day under penalty of anathema.”

    a·nath·e·ma

    /əˈnaTHəmə/
    noun
    noun: anathema; plural noun: anathemas

    1. something or someone that one vehemently dislikes.
    “racial hatred was anathema to her”

    synonyms: an abomination, an outrage, an abhorrence, a disgrace, an evil, a bane, a bugbear, a bête noire; adjectivesabhorrent, hateful, repugnant, odious, repellent, offensive
    “the idea of a poem as a mere exercise is anathema to me”

    2. a formal curse by a pope or a council of the Church, excommunicating a person or denouncing a doctrine.

    synonyms: an abomination, an outrage, an abhorrence, a disgrace, an evil, a bane, a bugbear, a bête noire; adjectivesabhorrent, hateful, repugnant, odious, repellent, offensive
    “the idea of a poem as a mere exercise is anathema to me”

    Not only did they change the observance day, they punished those who did keep the 7th Day. They killed many many Jews and Sabbath keeping sects of Nazarenes during the Crusades at the tip of the Templar sword.

    Catholic Priest T. Enright, CSSR, lecture at Hartford, KS, Feb 18, 1884:

    “I have repeatedly offered $1000 to any one who can furnish any proof from the Bible that Sunday is the day we are bound to keep…The Bible says, “Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy,” but the Catholic Church says, “No, keep the first day of the week,” and the whole world bows in obedience.”

    Cardinal John Newman, An Essay on the Development of Christian Doctrine (London: Basil Montague Pickering, 1878): 373:

    “The use of temples, and these dedicated to particular saints, and ornamented on occasions with branches of trees; incense, lamps, and candles; votive offerings on recovery from illness; holy water; asylums; holydays and seasons…are all of pagan origin and sanctified by their adoption into the Church.”

    Catholic Record (September 1, 1923):

    “The [catholic] Church is above the Bible, and this transference of the Sabbath observance is proof of that fact.”

    Letter from C.F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons on October 28, 1895:

    “Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change was her act…And the act is a MARK of her ecclesiastical power and authority in religious matters.”

    Now, onto the fact that we are Israel and there is no such thing as the “Gentile Church”. The Cross reconciled the Two Houses and made them one. Read Ezekiel 37 and the Two Stick Prophecy. WE ARE NO LONGER GENTILES. So, how will this massive restoration of a pure language, as it was before the tower of Babel, and how will the World be speaking of one consent during the Mellinium? What is it that will unite all the 12 Tribes into one accord?

    Isa 2:2 And it shall come to pass IN THE LAST DAYS, that the mountain of the LORD’S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and ALL NATIONS shall flow unto it. 3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and HE WILL TEACH US OF HIS WAYS, and WE WILL WALK IN HIS PATHS: for OUT OF ZION SHALL GO FORTH THE LAW, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.

    So many Christian doctrines are so anti-semetic it is a shame. Christians think the Jewish people are idiots, I mean, how could they possibly not see that Yeshua/Jesus is Messiah? Well friends, only YHVH can open the eyes of the blind and reveal to our Jewish BROTHERS. They will not be able to see him until they seek Him. He will reveal himself to them, and it will be a glorious day. There are as many Jews accepting Yeshua/Jesus today than there was during the time of the Apostles. This in itself is a sign that he will be returning sooner than most believe. Now, you made comment that no one had answered your rapture questions, so forgive me, I can’t seem to find what you asked, so please repeat it, thank you. You also commented that there is so much to read. My apologies, but digging into the meat of the Bible is not so cut and dry and sometimes needs going through with a fine tooth comb so we show ourselves approved of YHVH/God. He says his people are destroyed for lack of knowledge, so I seek it more than gold and silver as commanded. Sometimes, patience will teach us a great deal.

    “There was once a man who wanted to learn Torah. He was very impatient and wanted to learn it quickly so he went to a Sadducee and said, “I want to learn Torah, but I am in a hurry, so stand on one foot while you teach”. The Saducee replied, “This is impossible, it took me a lifetime to understand it the way I do today”. Then the man went to a Pharisee and asked him to do the same. The Pharisee replied, “There is no way to learn Torah in so short a time, and patience is a great virtue, unfortunately, in this situation I have no patience and it would be a waste of time”. Then the man went to a Nazarene, and said, “I have been to the Saducees and the Pharisees to learn Torah, but both refused to teach me. Now, I want to learn Torah, but I am in a hurry, so stand on one foot while you teach me”. So, the Nazarene stood on one foot and said, “Love your neighbor as you love yourself, the rest is commentary”.

    Shalom,
    Eric

  15. I RETURN, sorry it took FOREVER to respond I’ve been busy, anyways

    David, as you have said before this is a tennis match and we could go on and on and on about it to no end. I am staying to my belief that we do not need to participate in the feasts of Israel, and you, probably will (I hope not), stick to your belief of their necessity. 1 final point on that though:

    1 No I did not forget that my body is the temple, however, people can’t come up and do a feast in my heart. In my heart I can remember what Jesus did for me (which was what the Passover feast was, Leviticus 23:5), I can bring him my firstfruits (my first paycheck or first 10%, or simply my life), and overall make Jesus and the Glory of God my priority. This is what the feasts pointed to.

    Eric, a few points first ones on the Sabbath
    1 yes PROFANING the Sabbath is an act of evil, I get that, however, what do you mean by profaning it, more importantly what does the Bible mean by it, while you think read my other points
    2 Stephen was accused of speaking against the temple and the law himself by the high priests and their false witnesses (Acts 6:13), which though spoken through the mouth’s of the false witnesses, was true. He says in Acts 7:48 that the Christ does not dwell in a temple made by human hands. The earth is His footstool, He made the earth, and the maker of the temple. The temple is of limited importance in sight of it’s Creator.
    3 We know that Sunday was a significant day for the church. Paul instructed the Corinthians to observe it as a day of setting aside money for the ministry 1 Corinthians 16:2 and 2 Corithians 9:12. Paul clearly specifies this as a significant day of the week for Christians. In addition, he also broke bread/feasted on Sunday (Acts 20:7). Also, Jesus was resurrected on the 1st day of the week (Mark 16:2, Matthew 28:1, Luke 24:1, John 20:1, John 20:19, the Catholic Church did not invent that.
    4 Romans 14:5-6 “One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God;r and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.”
    5 Colosians 2:16 “Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths.”
    6 1 Corinthians 9:19-23 “19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law(though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.”

    Now to the pagan holidays

    1 we do not know the exact reason that the word Easter came about. It may have come about from the “Ishtar” or it could be from the old German word ostern which means dawn or east. (no one knows exactly) It is easy to know that Christ rose around dawnish on the 3rd day (Mark 16:2, Matthew 28:1) and He is also referenced as a literal sun (Psalm 84:11, Luke 1:78). It is entirely appropriate for us to celebrate Christs resurrection and for the name to allude to His being the rising Sun. Besides all that the name is irrelevant.
    2 For example nearly all of the days of the week are named after a pagan god (Sunday->sun-day, Monday->moon-day, Tuesday->Tiw’s day, Wednessday-> Woden’s day, Thursday->Thor’s day, Friday-> Frigga’s day), however, if we reference one of these days we aren’t worshiping the god.
    3 Because we worship God and celebrate Him on a certain day of the week or time of year does not cause us to be worshiping something else.
    4 As for the eggs and bunnies, both definitely signs of fertility. SO. Until I started researching the origins of Easter I didn’t even know that they represented fertility. Any pagan connection that MAY have once been is long gone. An egg role game is just a simple game for children (just as playing Call of Duty or whatever does not make me a killer, it’s just a game), and a chocolate bunny is just something tasty and an amazing treat. Besides, God created fertility, the pagans got it wrong by worshiping the creation, not the creator, if we praise the creator on the same day that we enjoy the creation(chocolate bunnies) we are not all of a sudden pagan.

    PS David, is the little note about the apocrypha an insult? just saying. I was just thinking to do something like finish the Bible by the end of the year. JUST THE BIBLE NOTHING ADDED
    PPS Eric, WHAT DOES SHALOM MEAN!
    PPPS when I go all caps lock it’s for emphasis, not to portray anger 🙂

  16. Eric-I will again address each point directly.

    “1 No I did not forget that my body is the temple, however, people can’t come up and do a feast in my heart. In my heart I can remember what Jesus did for me (which was what the Passover feast was, Leviticus 23:5), I can bring him my firstfruits (my first paycheck or first 10%, or simply my life), and overall make Jesus and the Glory of God my priority. This is what the feasts pointed to.”

    Ok, first off, you are blending the tithe with the firstfruits. The Firstfruits were given on the day after the weekly Sabbath after the Passover. So, the Feast of Firstfruits always falls on a Sunday, the first day of the week. The Firstfruits were given to be burned on the Altar as an offering to YHVH. The Tithe was to feed the Priests and it was not burned on the Altar in the Temple. Only a tenth part, or 10% of the tithe was offered to YHVH, the Levites had to offer their firstfruits as well. This command only applies to the Levites. If you want to pay your tithes according to the Bible, you are required to give the tithe in grain and flock offerings. If you choose to redeem your flock and grain offerings, you are commanded to add a fifth part, or 20% to your tithe if paid in coin to redeem the flock and grain offerings.

    Num 18:26 Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your INHERITANCE, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the LORD, even a TENTH PART OF THE TITHE. 27 And this your heave offering shall be reckoned unto you, as though it were the corn of the threshingfloor, and as the fulness of the winepress. 28 Thus ye also shall offer an heave offering unto the LORD of all your tithes, which ye receive of the children of Israel; and ye shall give thereof the LORD’S heave offering to Aaron the priest. 29 Out of all your gifts ye shall offer every heave offering of the LORD, of all the best thereof, even the hallowed part thereof out of it. 30 Therefore thou shalt say unto them, When ye have heaved the best thereof from it, then it shall be counted unto the Levites as the increase of the threshingfloor, and as the increase of the winepress. 31 And YE SHALL EAT IT IN EVERY PLACE(Not the Temple, the tithe is the inheritance of the Tribe of Levi, because they have no promised land inheritance), ye and your households: for IT IS YOUR REWARD FOR SERVICE IN THE TABERNACLE of the congregation. 32 And ye shall bear no sin by reason of it, when ye have heaved from it the best of it: neither shall ye pollute the holy things of the children of Israel, lest ye die.

    If you choose to pay your tithe in coin, you must add 20% to the already established 10%.

    Lev 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD’S: it is holy unto the LORD. 31 And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, HE SHALL ADD THERETO THE FIFTH PART(20%) THEREOF. 32 And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD. 33 He shall not search whether it be good or bad, neither shall he change it: and if he change it at all, then both it and the change thereof shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed. 34 These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai.

    So, I have two questions. Which Levites are you taking your tithes to. And two, are you adding 20% as commanded? The Tithe is the promised INHERITANCE of the Tribe of Levi. If you are paying tithes to others, you are robbing God and the Tribe of Levi, your Brothers.

    Mal 3:1 Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me(Elijah): and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall SUDDENLY COME TO HIS TEMPLE, EVEN THE MESSENGER OF THE COVENANT(Yeshua), whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts. 2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner’s fire, and like fullers’ soap: 3 And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall PURIFY THE SONS OF LEVI, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness. 4 Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years. 5 And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts. 6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. 7 EVEN FROM THE DAYS OF YOUR FATHERS YE ARE GONE AWAY FROM MINE ORDINANCES, AND HAVE NOT KEPT THEM. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return? 8 WILL A MAN ROB GOD? YET YE HAVE ROBBED ME. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? IN TITHES AND OFFERINGS. :9 Ye are cursed with a curse: FOR YE HAVE ROBBED ME, EVEN THIS WHOLE NATION. 10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. 11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts. 12 And ALL NATIONS shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts. 13 Your words have been stout against me, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, What have we spoken so much against thee? 14 Ye have said,IT IS VAIN TO SERVE GOD: AND WHAT PROFIT IS IT THAT WE SHOULD KEEP HIS ORDINANCE, and that we have walked mournfully before the LORD of hosts? 15 And now we call the proud happy; yea, they that work wickedness are set up; yea, they that tempt God are even delivered. 16 Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name. 17 And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. 18 Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.

    So, are you tithing according to the Bible, or are you tithing according to the Pastor? See this type of hypocrisy is what really makes me boil in the Churches. I have heard so many sermons guilting everyone to give “The Church” money, even the poor are guilted in by the Pastors telling them if they plant this type of seed that they will gain more in return. That is crap theology period. The poor are not required to tithe, the tithe, well part of it, is used to feed the poor, widows, and orphans. The Church will not go without her money. Go ask your Church to help a person that is not a “member” of your Church and see what they say. On the the next point.

    “Eric, a few points first ones on the Sabbath
    1 yes PROFANING the Sabbath is an act of evil, I get that, however, what do you mean by profaning it, more importantly what does the Bible mean by it, while you think read my other points”.

    The Bible explains exactly what profaning the Sabbath means, I do not need to “think” anything, we are already given the answer in the very scriptures I quoted that said profaning the Sabbath was an act of evil.

    Neh 13:15 In those days saw I in Judah some TREADING THE WINE PRESSES on the sabbath, and BRINGING IN SHEAVES, and LADING ASSES; as ALSO WINE, GRAPES, AND FIGS, and ALL MANNER OF BURDENS, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified against them in the day wherein they sold victuals. 16 There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, WHICH BROUGHT FISH, AND ALL MANNER OF WARE, and SOLD ON THE SABBATH unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem. 17 Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What EVIL THING is this that ye do, and PROFANE THE SABBATH day? 18 Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet YE BRING MORE WRATH ON ISRAEL FOR PROFANING THE SABBATH. 19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.

    The Command is to “Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy”. Then there is Torah/Instructions on HOW to keep the Sabbath Holy. We have all the things listed for us that are forbidden on the Sabbaths. Buying and selling, conducting any type of commerce, working in any way, bearing a burden or causing animals or other people to bear a burden or do any type of servile work. This means that any time you go out to eat from Friday sundown to Saturday sundown, you are profaning the Sabbath. We are also commanded to have a Holy Convocation on the Sabbath. This is gathering believers together to study, meditate, discuss, and preach the Word of God. When you fail to do this, you are profaning the Sabbaths. Here is the example I was trying to make about the difference in the commandment and the Torah/instructions on HOW to keep the commandment.

    Example- What does it mean when the Messiah says this?

    Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Many say that all we have to do is love God and Love our neighbor, no need to eat Kosher, no need to keep the Sabbaths, no need to observe YHVH’s Appointed Feast days, no need to do anything other than love God and love our neighbor. Well, we do need to do both these things, but how do we do that? The Ten Commandments can be summed up in these Two. The First 4 tell us how to love God, the last 6 tell us how to love our neighbor. We have initial commandments, the Two Greatest, and the Ten “hang from them” or can be summarized by them. The Torah/Law/Instructions hang from the Ten. How does this work?

    Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. (INITIAL COMMAND)

    Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.(INSTRUCTIONS/TORAH on HOW TO KEEP THE SABBATH HOLY)

    Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. (INITIAL COMMAND)

    Deu 6:6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart: 7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up. 8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. 9 And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.(TORAH/INSTRUCTIONS on HOW TO LOVE YHVH)

    So, without Torah/Instructions, you can not fulfill the Ten Commandments. Without Fulfilling the Ten, you have by default missed the Greatest Two as well. It works the same in our Governmental laws. WE have the Constitution, the BASE or FOUNDATION, then, we have all these other laws telling us how to keep these Constitutional laws. If we change the Instructions, we cannot fulfill the Constitutional laws. Is it a strange thing that the more we change YHVH’s instructions, adding to and removing them, he sends us Presidents and Judges who change the definitions of Constitutional law? What we do Spiritually, always effects the Physical. If you want your beloved Constitution back, all you have to do is repent and return to the Torah/Instructions of YHVH, else you will be sold into slavery as a useless servant according to the Word of the Holy Prophets. On to the next point.

    “2 Stephen was accused of speaking against the temple and the law himself by the high priests and their false witnesses (Acts 6:13), which though spoken through the mouth’s of the false witnesses, was true. He says in Acts 7:48 that the Christ does not dwell in a temple made by human hands. The earth is His footstool, He made the earth, and the maker of the temple. The temple is of limited importance in sight of it’s Creator.”

    Wow, those who give false reports are also now telling the Truth? A lie and false witness is just that, FALSE WITNESS, meaning Stephen was FALSELY accused of speaking against the Law/Torah. The Temple is of limited importance to the Creator?

    Isa 56:4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; 7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for MINE HOUSE shall be called an HOUSE OF PRAYER FOR ALL PEOPLE.

    Hag 2:6 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; Yet once, it is a little while, and I will shake the heavens, and the earth, and the sea, and the dry land; 7 And I will shake ALL NATIONS, AND THE DESIRE OF ALL NATIONS SHALL COME: AND I WILL FILL THIS HOUSE WITH GLORY, saith the LORD of hosts. 8 The silver is mine, and the gold is mine, saith the LORD of hosts. 9 The glory of THIS LATTER HOUSE SHALL BE GREATER THAN THE FORMER, saith the LORD of hosts: and IN THIS PLACE WILL I GIVE PEACE, saith the LORD of hosts.

    The Temple is the center of worship, everything in it points us to Yeshua as you have said. You say that Yeshua is all you focus on, but if that if true, why do you not do the things that Moses wrote about Him, and how can you believe the Messiah’s words if you do not believe the words of Moses?

    Joh 5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

    Luk 16:27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father’s house: 28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. 29 Abraham saith unto him, They have MOSES AND THE PROPHETS; LET THEM HEAR THEM. 30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. 31 And he said unto him, IF THEY HEAR NOT MOSES AND THE PROPHTS, NEITHER WILL THEY BE PERSUADED, THOUGH ONE ROSE FROM THE DEAD.

    All of Moses and the Prophets teach us all the little details about both the first, and the second coming of Yeshua/Jesus. How can we possibly watch for his second coming as we are commanded by the Apostles if we know nothing about the timing? He rebuked the Pharisees for not knowing the signs of the times. Guess where the signs we are to look for are given? All throughout Moses and the Prophets, and the 1st Century scriptures. Yeshua does EVERYTHING according to its appointed times as laid down in Lev. 23. The Feasts give us insight into his first and second coming. We observe these times because we are promised blessings for obedience of these things. The best example I can give is this; if the Israelites that made journey to Jerusalem from all Nations had not been obedient to the commandment to be in Jerusalem for Pentecost, they would not have received the Holy Spirit(blessing for obedience). Paul continued to keep the Feasts and even planned his travels around their appointed times. He observed them in Jerusalem when he could, and in the dispersia when he could not make it back to Jerusalem in time because of distance. In the Torah/Law, there are instructions given for them who can not make the journey in time because of travel distance, and Paul followed all of these commandments to the letter.

    Act 18:19 And he came to Ephesus, and left them there: but he himself entered into the synagogue, and reasoned with the Jews. 20 When they desired him to tarry longer time with them, HE CONSENTED NOT; 21 But bade them farewell, saying, I MUST BY ALL MEANS KEEP THE FEAST THAT COMETH IN JERUSALEM: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

    Act 20:16 For Paul had determined to sail by Ephesus, because he would not spend the time in Asia: for he hasted, if it were possible for him, to be at Jerusalem the day of Pentecost.

    Act 27:9 Now when much time was spent, and when sailing was now dangerous, because THE FAST(Day of Atonement) was now already past, Paul admonished them,

    1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: 8 Therefore LET US KEEP THE FEAST(Passover), not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

    Sorry about the depth, but it needs to be seen in full context, from the Law, Prophets, Writings, Gospels, and Revelation, from cover to cover it must agree. On to the next point.

    “3 We know that Sunday was a significant day for the church. Paul instructed the Corinthians to observe it as a day of setting aside money for the ministry 1 Corinthians 16:2 and 2 Corithians 9:12. Paul CLEARLY(emphasis mine) specifies this as a significant day of the week for Christians. In addition, he also broke bread/feasted on Sunday (Acts 20:7). Also, Jesus was resurrected on the 1st day of the week (Mark 16:2, Matthew 28:1, Luke 24:1, John 20:1, John 20:19, the Catholic Church did not invent that.”

    You are absolutely correct that Yeshua/Jesus was raised on the first day of the week, just as the Law/Torah prophesies. He was to be the FIRSTFRUITS to YHVH/God and he would be raised up on the Feast of Firstfruits, which always falls on the DAY AFTER THE SABBATH.

    Lev 23:10 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the FIRSTFRUITS of your harvest unto the priest: 11 And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: ON THE MORROW AFTER THE SABBATH the priest shall wave it.

    In this command, we see two things. The Feast of Firstfruits, which as already stated points us to the Messiah, is the day of resurrection, just as the Torah foretold, that it would be the day AFTER THE SABBATH.

    Mat 28:1 Now AFTER THE SABBATH, toward the dawn of the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb. 2 And behold, there was a great earthquake, for an angel of the Lord descended from heaven and came and rolled back the stone and sat on it. 3 His appearance was like lightning, and his clothing white as snow. 4 And for fear of him the guards trembled and became like dead men. 5 But the angel said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek Jesus who was crucified. 6 He is not here, for he has risen, as he said. Come, see the place where he lay.

    Again, this passage identifies that the Sabbath is on the 7th day of the week and not the first day. Christians decided to integrate the weekly Sabbath with the High Sabbath of the Feast of Firtfruits. There is no reason whatsoever to keep Sunday weekly because he was raised on the first day of the week, we already had a commanded Feast to observe foreshadowing His resurrection. Now, concerning the scriptures you give where Paul is gathering offerings to take to Jerusalem, again obeying the command to bring the offerings to Jerusalem, if we look at thye Greek in this text it does not say what our biased English translators have written.

    I have studied the “first day of the week” theory when the disciples met and found it faulty when put in light of the original Greek text. Though, in this process, I came across Acts 20:7 and 1 Corinthians 16:2 about “day one of the week” being in the Greek “Sabbaton”.

    THOUGHT TO CONSIDER:
    SABBATon is really a transliteration of SABBATH.
    In the Greek in both verses, the Greek text is MIA SABBATON. The English language has nominal and ordinal words, just as “one” and “first” ,Greek does as well. The Greek word for “first” is “protos”.
    Note how these two verses do NOT have protos (first) but the translators chose to translate it as “first” anyway, thus exposing their SUN-day bias.
    The Greek is “mia” which means “one”
    Also, the word Sabbaton here is PLURAL, much to the translators confusion.
    Thus, a correct rendering in English would be: “One of the Sabbaths”
    How does that make sense you might ask? Notice that in BOTH Acts 20 and 1 Cor. 16 that the context is inclusive of Pentecost (Shavuot).Now you might see it, what “one of the Sabbaths” is referring to. It is referring to “one of the Sabbaths” that leads up to Shavuot(Pentecost)…one of the 7 Sabbaths…the counting of the omer as it is traditionally called. AGAIN, we see Paul keeping the commandment to count the days to Pentecost.

    Lev 23:15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow AFTER THE SABBATH(first day of the week), from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering(Feast of Firstfruits); SEVEN SABBATHS shall be complete: 16 Even unto THE MORROW AFTER THE SEVENTH SABBATH shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD. 17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals: they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD. 18 And ye shall offer with the bread seven lambs without blemish of the first year, and one young bullock, and two rams: they shall be for a burnt offering unto the LORD, with their meat offering, and their drink offerings, even an offering made by fire, of sweet savour unto the LORD. 19 Then ye shall sacrifice one kid of the goats for a sin offering, and two lambs of the first year for a sacrifice of peace offerings. 20 And the priest shall wave them with the bread of the firstfruits for a wave offering before the LORD, with the two lambs: they shall be holy to the LORD for the priest. 21 And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day, that it may be an holy convocation unto you: ye shall do no servile work therein: it shall be a statute FOE EVER (olam in Hebrew, meaning without end, perpetual, eternal, etc.)in all your dwellings throughout your generations.

    Paul was counting the Sabbaths as they were still observing the Sabbaths. You cannot find the date to Pentecost without counting the Sabbaths. The God given calendar is not the same as the secular one you use. Everything is done by observance of the sun, moon, and stars. The Sun, moon, and stars were given specifically for this reason.

    Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.

    So in closing on this point, yes, Yeshua was raised on the First day of the week becoming the fulfillment of the Firtsfruits Harvest.

    1Co 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the FIRSTFRUITS of them that slept.

    1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the FIRSTFRUITS; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.

    There is no reason to change the Sabbath to the first day of the week because of the resurrection, the resurrection was prophesied to be the Feast of Firstfruits, falling on the first day of the week every year. It has absolutely nothing to do with the weekly Sabbath. There is no reasoning, nor scriptural authority for the change of the Sabbath. Paul kept every Sabbath, which was still the 7th day, teaching in the Synagogues with both Jews and Greeks(Gentiles).

    Act 18:1 After these things Paul departed from Athens, and came to Corinth; 2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy, with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart from Rome:) and came unto them. 3 And because he was of the same craft, he abode with them, and wrought: for by their occupation they were tentmakers. 4 And he reasoned in the SYNAGOGUE EVERY SABBATH, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

    He kept the Feasts and even planned His travels around them. He counted the omer, counting 7 Sabbaths and then on Sunday, Pentecost(Shavuot). He observed the Day of Atonement, Pentecost, Passover, and Unleavened Bread, all recorded in the Book of Acts and His own letters. On the the next point.

    “4 Romans 14:5-6 “One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God;r and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.”
    5 Colosians 2:16 “Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths.”

    When we put these scriptures in context, the Romans scripture is speaking about fasting on certain days or not fasting on certain days, it says absolutely nothing about the Sabbaths. Paul says do not argue over matters of OPINION. There is no command to fast, it is done from the heart. They were arguing over wheich days would be their days to fast, but since there is no commandment to fast other than on the Day of Atonement, it did not matter what day one chooses.

    . Rom 14:2 One person believes he may EAT ANYTHING, while the weak person EATS ONLY VEGETABLES. 3 Let not the one who EATS despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who EATS, for God has welcomed him. 4 Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one WHO EATS, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God.

    This has absolutely nothing about the Sabbath at all. Cherry picking scriptures out of context is what has led everyone estray, people do not test the Spirits to see if they of God anymore. The Colossians 2 scripture is telling us not to let anyone jusge us FOR observing these things. We can see that the “ordinances” that are spoken of in Colossians 2 is traditions and commandments of men. It says nothing about the Laws of God. Let us put the scripture in context and look at the original language shall we.

    Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through PHILOSOPHY AND VAIN DECIET, after the TRADITIONS OF MEN, after the RUDIMENTS OF THE WORLD, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: 11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances(DOGMA) that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 And having SPOILED POWERS AND PRINCIPALITIES, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 LET NO MAN THEREFOR JUDGE YOU IN MEAT, OR IN DRINK, or in respect of an Holy Day, or of the NEW MOON, or of the SABBATH DAYS: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. 18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and WOEHIPPING OF ANGELS, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his FLESHLY MIND, 19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the RUDIMENTS OF THE WORLD, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances(DOGMA), 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the COMMANDMENTS AND DOCTRINES OF MEN? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

    The Greek word “Dogma” is never used in conjunction with the Laws of God that were given through Moses. Every time this word is used, the command originates from men, not God.

    G1378
    δόγμα
    dogma
    dog’-mah
    From the base of G1380; a law (civil, ceremonial or ecclesiastical): – decree, ordinance.

    It is never used in conjunction with the Laws of God and is always an ordinance of men.

    G1378
    δόγμα
    dogma
    Total KJV Occurrences: 5
    decrees, 2
    Act_16:4, Act_17:7
    ordinances, 2
    Eph_2:15, Col_2:14
    decree, 1
    Luk_2:1

    We see in the context of the whole chapter that that all Paul is teaching against is man made doctrines, not the Feasts, New Moons, Sabbaths, etc. He was not speaking against the law and he was telling these newly converted Gentiles not to let the Jews judge them for observing the Sabbaths, New Moons, and Holy Days. Jewish law, NOT GOD’S LAW, forbids Gentiles to observe these appointed times under punishment of death. The “ordinances” that these Gnostic Jews, also known as Kabbalists were declaring are recorded and gives us great insight into why Paul would tell the Gentiles not to let these Gnostic Jews judge them for observing these things. Here are a few examples.

    The Maharsha (Sanhedrin 58b) compares Shabbos to the bride of the Jewish people, and compares gentiles observing it to adultery:

    The Maharsha explains that the Sabbath is, metaphorically, a bride. Indeed, the Talmud refers to the Sabbath as a bride and the Shabbos is greeted in the same way that a bride is greeted. This imagery was immortalized by Rabbi Shlomo Alkabetz (a 16th century poet and Kabbalist from Tzfas) in his classical liturgical song, Lecha Dodi, which is sung just before the reception of the Holy Shabbos. Rabbi Avraham Sperling writes, based on this allegorical comparison, that “Shabbos” is the female companion to the Israelite nation. The Jewish Nation is “married” to Shabbos. Therefore, when a non-Jew follows the rules of Shabbos, it is as if he is committing “adultery” with the married bride “Shabbos”, and so he is liable for the death penalty.

    He suggest (based on Rashi’s explanation) that the resting of Shabbos is an exclusive gift to the Jews:

    When Adam sinned by eating the Forbidden Fruit, he was punished by all future males having to work, “with the sweat of his brow.” This implies that HaShem expects man to work continuously without rest. However, two thousand four hundred and forty-eight years later, HaShem granted the Jews a special present, namely, the Holy Sabbath, with which they can rest, in contrast to the remainder of society. Therefore, world society is not allowed to rest because of the curse of Adam, while the Jews are allowed to rest because the Torah specifically calls for a Mitzvah of Shabbos, which was a unique gift granted to the Jewish Nation . . Rabbi Meir ben Todros HaLevi Abulafia (1170-1244) explains that the gift of Shabbos was given specifically to the Jews, and therefore if a Noahide keeps Shabbos, he is actually stealing from the Jews and is therefore liable for the prohibition of stealing (which is one of the Seven Noachide Laws).

    Now you can see CLEARLY why Paul would tell the Gentiles to not let these Gnostic Jews judge them for observing the Appointed times. You made the comment that Paul “clearly specifies this as a significant day of the week for Christians”, meaning the first day of the week, but when looked at in its original language we find that they were keeping the Sabbaths and counting the days to Pentecost(Shavuot) as well. Peter says Paul is NOT so crystal clear and that people who misunderstand his writings could lead one into the “error of lawless people”.

    2Pe 3:15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. THERE ARE SOME THINGS IN THEM THAT ARE HARD TO UNDERSTAND, which the ignorant and unstable twist TO THEIR OWN DESTRUCTION, as they do the other Scriptures. 17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with THE ERROR OF LAWLESS PEOPLE and lose your own stability.

    So, Paul is not so clear and his letters should be treated with the utmost scrutiny in order to get the fullness of what he is teaching, and I assure you, everything he is teaching is directly from Moses. We find this FACT in the story of the Bereans.

    Act 17:10 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming thither went into the synagogue of the Jews. 11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

    At this point in time, the only scriptures thay had was Moses and the Prophets. What Paul was teaching was coming directly from the dubbed “Old Testament”. Remember,

    2Ti 3:16 ALL SCRIPTURE(not some) is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable FOR DOCTRINE, for REPROOF, for CORRECTION, for INSTRUCTION IN RIGHTEOUSNESS: 17 That the man of God MAY BE PERFECT, throughly furnished unto all GOOD WORKS.

    On to the next point. All parenthesis will be emphasis I add.

    “6 1 Corinthians 9:19-23 “19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law(THOUGH I AM NOT FEE FROM GOD’S LAW but am UNDER CHRIST”S LAW), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.”

    If you are insinuating that Paul is teaching against the law in any way here, I would ask you to reread verse 21. The term “under the law” is a Hebrew idiom that means you are under the law’s curse, for being disobedient. Yeshua lifted the CURSE of God’s law FOR THEM THAT BELIEVE(belief is followed by action, as James says “Faith without works is dead”) but he did not remove the BLESSINGS. The Law is set up on BLESSINGS and CURSES, BLESSINGS if you obey, CURSES if you don’t. Not that hard of a concept to understand. We raise our children on the same system. On the the next point.

    “Now to the pagan holidays

    1 we do not know the exact reason that the word Easter came about. It may have come about from the “Ishtar” or it could be from the old German word ostern which means dawn or east. (no one knows exactly) It is easy to know that Christ rose around dawnish on the 3rd day (Mark 16:2, Matthew 28:1) and He is also referenced as a literal sun (Psalm 84:11, Luke 1:78). It is entirely appropriate for us to celebrate Christs resurrection and for the name to allude to His being the rising Sun. Besides all that the name is irrelevant.
    2 For example nearly all of the days of the week are named after a pagan god (Sunday->sun-day, Monday->moon-day, Tuesday->Tiw’s day, Wednessday-> Woden’s day, Thursday->Thor’s day, Friday-> Frigga’s day), however, if we reference one of these days we aren’t worshiping the god.
    3 Because we worship God and celebrate Him on a certain day of the week or time of year does not cause us to be worshiping something else.
    4 As for the eggs and bunnies, both definitely signs of fertility. SO. Until I started researching the origins of Easter I didn’t even know that they represented fertility. Any pagan connection that MAY have once been is long gone. An egg role game is just a simple game for children (just as playing Call of Duty or whatever does not make me a killer, it’s just a game), and a chocolate bunny is just something tasty and an amazing treat. Besides, God created fertility, the pagans got it wrong by worshiping the creation, not the creator, if we praise the creator on the same day that we enjoy the creation(chocolate bunnies) we are not all of a sudden pagan.

    I will agree concerning some aspects of this point, such as us not really knowing where the word “Easter” came from, but what we DO know is it is not Biblical in the least, the word is truly foreign to every translation of the scriptures outside the KJV. The Greek word used where the KJV has “Easter” is “pascha”, and every single other time the word appears it is translated as Passover, which is the accurate translation. What I will point out though is because the Roman Church created the Julian Calendar that we go by in the secular world, the Biblical Calendar stopped being observed due to persecution of the Saints and decrees from the Bishops of Rome that anyone caught observing the “Jewish Days” should be excommunicated and even put to death. Rome took complete control of the known world and allowed only those of “noble blood” to learn to read and right and the only way they knew to worship Yeshua was by what the Roman Catholic Priests taught them. All Sabbath keeping sects and all Jews who refused to submit to the Roman Church were killed on order of the Bishops of Rome. There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever that Rome pushed out the Biblical Holy Days and instituted Pagan Customs into the liturgy. It is self evident. Where in the Bible does the Roman Church get its liturgy? Where do many of the “Protestant” sects find their traditions? The Churches do “Harvest Festivals” during Halloween instead of during the appointed times that God has ordained. They still dress up in “non-scary” costumes and give out candy. I will say some do not do this but most do. The so called “Early Church Fathers” and the Anti-Nicean Fathers all speak of Pagan traditions being pushed into Christianity. You point out the “three days and three nights” and the whole of Catholic/Protestant Christianity say that he was killed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday. That my friend is not three days and three nights. His crucifixion was on a Wednsday, in the middle of the week as Prophesied. I am almost positive that you Celebrate Christmas. Most Christian Churches still teach that Jesus was born during Christmas, yet the Bible has his Birth being on the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles. Christmas with all its traditions is Pagan and that is undisputable. Also, the Christian “Easter” does not always line up with the Feast of Firstfruits, the actual resurrection day. All denominations, from Baptist to Catholics have some form of Paganism in their liturgy. I blame it mostly on the Church of Rome, but the Protestant Churches should also be held accountable for keeping the Pagan aspects in the liturgies. I talk to Pastors on a daily bases and most of them openly admit that Christianity in oits many forms have Pagan aspects that have been adopted over the years, it really isn’t a secret, accept to the Assemblies of course, can’t mess with that tithe income. Churches of today are a business selling a product. The image of the Messiah that they are putting out is a false image. There are 38000 denominations all with varying and changing doctrines contradicting one another and even themselves many times. Now, you say that basically God does not care if one plays Call of Duty or if they partake in harmless chocolate bunnies, but I assure you and I am about to prove that God hates the mixing of Pagan Customs with the worship of Him more than he hates anything else. He tells us plainly, DO NOT worship Him in the same way the Nations worship their gods, and those so called “tasty and an amazing treats” he hates more than anything.

    Deu 12:28 Be careful to obey all these words that I command you, that it may go well with you and with your children after you forever, when you do what is good and right in the sight of the LORD your God. 29 “When the LORD your God cuts off before you the nations whom you go in to dispossess, and you dispossess them and dwell in their land, 30 take care that you be NOT ENSNARED TO FOLLOW THEM, after they have been destroyed before you, and that you do not inquire about their gods, saying, ‘How did these nations serve their gods?–that I also may do the same.’ 31 YOU SHALL NOT WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD IN THAT WAY , for every abominable thing that the LORD hates they have done for their gods, for they even burn their sons and their daughters in the fire to their gods. 32 “Everything that I command you, you shall be careful to do. YOU SHALL NOT ADD TO IT OR TAKE FROM IT.

    Paul told the Galatians that he had labored IN VAIN over them when he found them once again instituting the Pagan customs with the worship of YHVH.

    Gal 4:8 Formerly, when you did not know God, you were enslaved to those THAT BY NATURE ARE NOT GODS(Pagan gods). 9 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and worthless elementary principles of the world, whose slaves you want to be once more? 10 You observe days and months and seasons and years! 11 I AM AFRAID I HAVE LABORED OVER YOU IN VAIN.

    Paul lets the Church at Corinth that mixing these customs in again is done in vain, meaning it is absolutely WORTHLESS. I have already shown you the Promises and the Judgment for ALL NATIONS that keep the Sabbaths and the Feasts, there is no need for me to repeat myself, but if God judged Israel for the same exact behavior, what makes you think that he does not care if we add Pagan elements to the worship? The whole reason Israel was divorced in the first place is because she was whoring with other gods, why would you think it is suddenly ok for the “Gentile Church” who for some reason wants to separate themselves from Israel as much as possible. God made the NEW COVENANT with Israel, not some Gentile Church. If you are born a Gentile and believe in the Messiah you then become an Israelite. You are not “Spiritual Israel”, you do not replace Israel, you ARE Israel.

    Eph 2:11 Therefore remember that AT ONE TIME(past tense)you Gentiles in the flesh, called “the uncircumcision” by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands– 12 remember that you were AT THAT TIME SEPERATED FROM CHRIST, alienated from the COMMONWEALTH OF ISRAEL and strangers to the covenants(plural) of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off HAVE BEEN BROUGHT NEAR by the blood of Christ.

    God hates it when his people mix Pagan idolatry into the worship of Him. When Aaron made the golden calf, he did not say this was a different god, he called him by name, he declared “This be the God that brought you out of Egypt, tomorrow shall be a Feast to YHVH. YHVH did not see it quite the same. He did not say that Aaron was worshipping a different God, he told Moses that the Israelites had gone out of the way that he commanded them to worship Him.

    Exo 32:4 And he received them at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These be thy elohim(God), O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt. 5 And when Aaron saw it, he built an altar before it; and Aaron made proclamation, and said, Tomorrow is a FEAST TO YAHWEH.

    Exo 32:7 And Yahweh said unto Moses, Go, get thee down; for thy people, which thou broughtest out of the land of Egypt, have corrupted themselves: 8 They have turned aside quickly out of THE WAY WHICH I COMMANDED THEM: they have made them a molten calf, and have worshipped it, and have sacrificed thereunto, and said, These be thy elohim, O Israel, which have brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.

    YHVH did not see it as a harmless golden calf, he is a jealous God and he had 3000 men slaughtered that day, but the Easter Bunny and the Pagan egg hunts and things the like are all of a sudden ok with Him? I think not. Paul says it is all done in vain and the Prophets ALL speak of judgment when people act this way. The very definition of “lukewarm” is mixing hot and cold. God HATES mixing.

    Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. 14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

    Shalom means “peace”, but its a little deeper than the English understanding, telling someone Shalom is like telling them to go in peace. Even though we pretty much completely disagree on doctrine, I wish you peace and also that you be given wisdom and knowledge, many of your arguments are the same as we here a lot, it is self evident that you are just repeating the same passages that come from the Semitaries, I mean Seminaries, to the Pastors, then to you. I am almost willing to bet that you have looked at several teachings that Pastors write to refute what we teach. I wish you could have seen it from both sides, because we make sure the Word does not contradict, and if it does, you are misunderstanding something. Most of it is due to bad translations, which was prophesied, and some because no one knows the History of our people. Most of it is ignorance, but trust me when I say this, many, again, many Pastors speak evil of us even though we just want the Body of Messiah to be of one accord. The only thing the 38000 denominations agree on is that at least some portion of the law has been abolished or that Jews and non-Jews have different sets of standard. No wonder they are not of one accord. Christianity is based on the Bible, but there are many movies that are based on the truth in Holywood. We must ask what is authentic Truth, absolute truth, and what is partial truth or a flat out lie.Anyway, I would like to tell you,

    Shalom,
    Eric

  17. Dear Eric and David, I sincerely apologize for not responding to your previous point even after I said I would. I have been busy and lazy and forgetful. When I do remember and prepare to do something about it, I type up a prepared response to one of your points, however there are so many that I will never finish. So instead of answering all your points, I will leave you with 1.

    -There is a song, maybe you have heard it, but this is the gist of it:
    Glad day! Glad day!
    Jesus might come today!
    Glad day! Glad day!
    Jesus might come today!
    However a post-trib rapture standpoint destroys the immanency of Christ’s return. He can return any day, we have a blessed hope that He could come at any moment. ANY MOMENT. However a this is the song from the perspective of a post-tribber.
    Sad day! Sad day!
    Jesus can’t come today!
    Sad day! Sad day!
    Jesus can’t come today!
    If the rapture occurs after the tribulation, we will know exactly when it happens. 7 years after a contract between the Antichrist and Israel is signed. However, Jesus comes like a thief in the night, WE CANNOT KNOW WHEN HE COMES.
    -Revelation 3:3
    -1 Thessalonians 5:2-6
    -Luke 21:34-35
    -Luke 12:35-40
    -Mark 13:32-35
    -2 Peter 3:10
    Again I apologize for the lateness of my final response. Forgive me. And I pray that you carefully consider what I have told to you.

    Sincerely,

    Andrew (aka Tomathy)

  18. I will tend to disagree with the point you are trying to make that he can return on any day. He can not return on any day, he MUST return on the Day that the Father has set aside for Him, the Feast of Trumpets. The idea that no one can know the timing of the coming Messiah is NOT again NOT a Biblical doctrine, butt one conceived by men. The phrase “no man knows the day or the hour, only the Father in Heaven knows” comes from Marriage customs of the Hebrews, and they, even before he came the first time, understood that the Messiah that they call “Mosciach Ben David” will come on the Feast of Trumpets. The phrase is a Hebrew idiom. When it is said, “No man knows the day or hour”, he is giving us the exact timing of His return. To the unlearned, the people who do not study the Torah, or the Prophets, this phrase simply means we can never know, but to the man who has the precepts and understands the culture, language, and customs of Hebrews, which the entire “early Church” consisted of, it tells us exactly the timing of the coming of our Messiah. We are told to watch and be vigilant, to read all the signs pointing to His return. As Paul states, the Torah is what points us to the Messiah so it will be the Torah that leads us to understand the end, after all, Yah says Himself, “I tell the end from the beginning and there is none other like me”. Yeshua/Jesus and the Apostles all gave us hints, and even direct statements concerning the timing of the coming of Yeshua/Jesus. As stated, the Hebrew idiom “no man knows the day or hour, only the Father knows” is from the wedding customs, and it tells us that it is the Feast of Trumpets because no one can predict when the Feast of Trumpets begins. It falls on a New Moon, and the New Moon cannot be predicted, only observed. It is the New Moon that tells us when the Feast starts, but the New Moon can’t be predicted, so the Jews set apart two days for the Feast. Two Witnesses were sent by the Priests to sight the New Moon and when the Feast began, the Priests would blow the Shofar/ram’s horn/trumpet to let Jerusalem know the Feast had started. Yeshua tells us he will return with a Trumpet call of YHVH.

    Mat 24:29 “IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he will send out his angels with a LOUD TRUMPET CALL, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    Paul tells us which Trumpet call it will be.

    1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, AT THE LAST TRUMP: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

    Paul also tells us that those who remain alive on Earth after the Tribulation WILL NOT be changed before the first resurrection, the resurrection of the Saints and Prophets.

    1Th 4:13 But WE WOULD NOT HAVE YOU IGNORANT, brethren, concerning them that fall asleep; that ye sorrow not, even as the rest, who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also that are fallen asleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we that are alive, that are left unto the coming of the Lord,SHALL IN NO WISE PRECEDE THEM THAT ARE ASLEEP. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the TRUMPET OF GOD: and THE DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE FIRST; 17 THEN we that are alive, that are left, shall together with them be caught up in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    Paul tells us plainly that the dead in Christ will rise FIRST, then those who are left alive will be caught up to meet those who have risen in the air with Yeshua. It is pretty cut and dry, not a subject that can be interpreted loosely. It says that he will return at “the last trump”, so when is the last trump?

    Rev 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and one said, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 And the court which is without the temple leave without, and measure it not; for it hath been given unto the nations: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 3 And I will give unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 4 These are the two olive trees and the two candlesticks, standing before the Lord of the earth. 5 And if any man desireth to hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth and devoureth their enemies; and if any man shall desire to hurt them, in this manner must he be killed. 6 These have the power to shut the heaven, that it rain not during the days of their prophecy: and they have power over the waters to turn them into blood, and to smite the earth with every plague, as often as they shall desire. 7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that cometh up out of the abyss shall make war with them, and overcome them, and kill them. 8 And their dead bodies lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified.9 And from among the peoples and tribes and tongues and nations do men look upon their dead bodies three days and a half, and suffer not their dead bodies to be laid in a tomb. 10 And they that dwell on the earth rejoice over them, and make merry; and they shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwell on the earth. 11 And after the three days and a half the breath of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them that beheld them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they went up into heaven in the cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And in that hour there was a GREAT EARTHQUAKE, and the tenth part of the city fell; and there were killed in the earthquake seven thousand persons: and the rest were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. 14 The second Woe is past: behold, the third Woe cometh quickly. 15 And the SEVENTH ANGEL SOUNDED; and there followed great voices in heaven, and they said, The kingdom of the world is become the kingdom of our Lord, and of his Christ: and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16 And the four and twenty elders, who sit before God on their thrones, fell upon their faces and worshipped God, 17 saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God, the Almighty, who art and who wast; because thou hast taken thy great power, and didst reign. 18 And the nations were wroth, and thy wrath came, and the TIME OF THE DEAD TO BE JUDGED, and THE TIME TO GIVE THEIR REWARD to thy servants THE PROPHETS, AND TO THE SAINTS, and to them that fear thy name, the small and the great; and to destroy them that destroy the earth. 19 And there was opened the temple of God that is in heaven; and there was seen in his temple the ark of his covenant; and there followed LIGHTNINGS, and VOICES, and THUNDERS, and AN ERTHQUAKE, and GREAT HAIL.

    Mat 27:51 And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. 52 The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, 53 and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many. 54 When the centurion and those who were with him, keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe and said, “Truly this was the Son of God!”

    We see in this account that the Earth shook, and the tombs of many Saints opened and the Saints were raised and were seen by many, shortly following an Earthquake. The same pattern we see when the Two Prophets of YHVH are raised from the dead and the Saints are raised shortly afterwards, also following an Earthquake. The Two Witnesses are the second half of the Messianic Ministry. You see, he told us that if a man sins against another, then you must go tell him between just the two of you. This is what Yeshua did in His first coming, he came to tell us of our sins and then offered himself up as atonement for them. Matthew 18 says that if the man you are rebuking repents, then you have gained a Brother. If he does not, you are to then send TWO WITNESSES to tell him of his sins. If he does not listen to them, you are to bring him in front of the congregation. If he still refuses to repent, you are to cast them from the assembly and treat them as unbelievers, heathens and tax collectors. The Two Witnesses will be the Two Witnesses that will tell us of our sins. The thing is, since there are Two Witnesses, they can conduct capital punishment, or proclaim death on them that rebel.

    3 And I will give unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 4 These are the two olive trees and the two candlesticks, standing before the Lord of the earth. 5 And if any man desireth to hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth and devoureth their enemies; and if any man shall desire to hurt them, in this manner must he be killed. 6 These have the power to shut the heaven, that it rain not during the days of their prophecy: and they have power over the waters to turn them into blood, and to smite the earth with every plague, as often as they shall desire.

    It was foretold that the Messiah would speak in Parables, dark sayings of old. Sometimes he does not literally mean what is said. Such an example could be made when he told us to drink his blood and eat his flesh. He did not literally mean drink his blood or eat his flesh, that is forbidden in the Torah and the New Testament(Acts 15). He was speaking in dark sayings, or words that have hidden meanings when he said “no man knows the day or the hour”. This as I have explained is a dark saying understood long before he came. The Jews knew that the Messiah would come on the Feast of Trumpets. Here is a brief explaination of the customs and cultural context of the Feast and its Messianic implications.

    http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Holidays/Fall_Holidays/Rosh_Hashannah/rosh_hashannah.html

    I know what is taught in Christianity concerning these things as I came from Christianity and converted to become a true Hebrew(Not a Jew, Hebrew means one who has crossed over from death to life, Abraham was a Hebrew but he was not Jewish). The Pastors have absolutely no understanding of the Book of Revelation, which was prophesied by the way, and they do not look into the Word of the Messiah deeply, they simply repeat what they have been taught in Semitary, I mean Seminary. I am amazed at how many use the same arguments, against scripture if I may add. Did you ever wonder why your Pastors really never wanted to get into deep Prophecy study? The answer is they have no idea what to teach you because they have made void the Torah/Instructions/Law of YHVH. They teach the precepts of men, not the Oracles of God. This was foretold.

    Isa 29:10 For the LORD has poured out upon you a spirit of deep sleep, and has closed your eyes (the prophets), and covered your heads (the seers). 11 And the vision of all this has become to you like the words of a book that is sealed. When men give it to one who can read, saying, “Read this,” he says, “I cannot, for it is sealed.” 12 And when they give the book to one who cannot read, saying, “Read this,” he says, “I cannot read.” 13 And the Lord said: “Because this people draw near with their mouth and honor me with their lips, while their hearts are far from me, and their fear of me is a PRECEPT TAUGHT BY MEN , 14 therefore, behold, I will again do wonderful things with this people, with wonder upon wonder; and the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the discernment of their discerning men shall be hidden.”

    Yeshua quotes this very verse to the Pharisees, scolding them for observing their own traditions and rejecting the commandments of God.

    Mat 15:1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, “What you would have gained from me is given to God,” 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: 8 “‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 9 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.'”

    Christianity has done the same, they have rejected the commandments of God in order to observe their own traditions, many of which can not be found in your Bible. The observance of Sunday is but one, but a MAJOR one. If you do not let the scriptures interpret themselves as I have done here to show the timing of the Second Coming, and follow after the imagination of your own hearts and lean on your own understanding, you will not be able to follow the command to watch for the signs of His coming. If he did not want us to know, he would not have written so much Prophecy for us to discern. The Churches do not study Prophecy hardly at all, so how could they possibly know what the will of YHVH is?

    Luk 16:27 And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father, to send him to my father’s house– 28 for I have five brothers–so that he may warn them, lest they also come into this place of torment.’ 29 But Abraham said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’ 30 And he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ 31 He said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.'”

    This says if you do not hear Moses and the Prophets, you will not be truly persuaded even since the Messiah rose from the dead. It is Moses and the Prophets who foretell of the Messiah. It is in Moses and the Prophets you will find all the details concerning Prophecy. Our forefathers knew when he was coming, that is why John was searching for Him the first time he came.

    Joh 1:35 The next day again John was standing with two of his disciples, 36 and he looked at Jesus as he walked by and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God!” 37 The two disciples heard him say this, and they followed Jesus. 38 Jesus turned and saw them following and said to them, “What are you seeking?” And they said to him, “Rabbi” (which means Teacher), “where are you staying?” 39 He said to them, “Come and you will see.” So they came and saw where he was staying, and they stayed with him that day, for it was about the tenth hour. 40 One of the two who heard John speak and followed Jesus was Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother. 41 He first found his own brother Simon and said to him, “We have found the Messiah” (which means Christ).

    On the opposite end of the spectrum, he rebuked the Saducees and Pharisees for not knowing the timing of His first coming.

    Mat 16:1 The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven. 2 He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. 3 And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye HYPOCRITES, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?

    We are commanded to watch and be sober.

    1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. 2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, ARE NOT IN DARKNESS that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore LET US NOT SLEEP, as do others; but LET US WATCH and be sober. 7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

    For a better understanding of how to interpret parables, please read my teaching “The Parables: Understanding the Hidden Mysteries”.

    http://teshuvaministries.net/the-parables-understanding-hidden-mysteries/

    There is no doubts whatsoever that there will be no pre-trib Rapture, and also that the Torah still stands, the entire Torah. You cannot possibly understand Revelation without Torah, as all, again, all judgments given in the Book of Revelation are all, again, all, judgments YHVH delivered to Moses. This is why Yeshua said that those who do not believe Moses’s Words can not possibly believe His Words.

    Joh 5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

    I will leave you with this. You are correct on one thing, there is definitely a lot of scripture that you can’t reply to, because it would surely contradict the rest of the Bible with your man-made interpretations. The Bible says that all wisdom and knowledge can be found in His Law.

    Psa 119:97 MEM. O how love I thy law! it is my meditation all the day. 98 Thou through thy commandments hast made me wiser than mine enemies: for they are ever with me. 99 I have more understanding than all my teachers: for thy testimonies are my meditation. 100 I understand more than the ancients, because I keep thy precepts. 101 I have refrained my feet from every evil way, that I might keep thy word. 102 I have not departed from thy judgments: for thou hast taught me. 103 How sweet are thy words unto my taste! yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth! 104 Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105 NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. 106 I have sworn, and I will perform it, that I will keep thy righteous judgments. 107 I am afflicted very much: quicken me, O LORD, according unto thy word. 108 Accept, I beseech thee, the freewill offerings of my mouth, O LORD, and teach me thy judgments. 109 My soul is continually in my hand: yet do I not forget thy law.

    David was a man after Yah’s own heart. I pray that your eyes have been opened, Shalom.

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